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Body count rises as Philippines president calls for drug addicts to be killed

asiancorrespondent.com

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Re: Body count rises as Philippines president calls for drug addicts to be killed

#171

Post by jdimov10 »

norswap wrote: post #148
jister wrote: post #127

DISCLAIMER: I am a Filipino and I live in the Philippines When an international media writes something without much knowledge on what's really going on it blows out of proportion. Now let me give you an idea of our situation here before the Duterte presidency. HISTORY ============== The Marcoses and Aquinos and their cronies, have brought the Philippines to its knees for decades (50 years). These families are what we…

Gotta love your brand of moral relativism.

Morals and ethics can only ever be relative / subjective / personal. Moral absolutism is the root of all evil.

Re: Body count rises as Philippines president calls for drug addicts to be killed

#172

Post by jister »

jacquesm wrote: post #159
lostlogin wrote: post #156

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Did you actually? And this also brings up another question, what counts as a drug?

No, I'm just making the point that we have a judicial process because merely claiming someone is a criminal should not be enough to get them killed. OP is anonymous so I didn't see any harm in this. I don't use drugs, don't drink (pretty boring person here). > And this also brings up another question, what counts as a drug? Well, it's simple: that's the stuff the person you just killed was selling to your nephew thre…

Those related to drugs were killed during a buy-bust operation. And yes, there is judicial process but people will read more if the media highlights and writes about "extrajudicial killing" instead.

Re: Body count rises as Philippines president calls for drug addicts to be killed

#173

Post by jacquesm »

sedachv wrote: post #119
OoTheNigerian wrote: post #43

As usual, mostly western commentators sitting on their high horses pointing and pontificating with no idea of local context or understanding. First of all, Duterte was elected overwhelmingly with a clear mandate of using brute violence to clear out drug dealers. He was clear about it and he is delivering on that mandate. I have to accept, he has made a PR error by not calling them terrorists. At which point, he will…

> First of all, Duterte was elected overwhelmingly with a clear mandate of using brute violence to clear out drug dealers. And journalists too! Kill everyone you don't like! > “Just because you’re a journalist you are not exempted from assassination, if you’re a son of a bitch,” Duterte said when asked how he would address the problem of media killings in the Philippines, after a reporter was shot dead in Manila last…

Why am I not surprised that the person who sees the solution to a countries problems growing out of the barrel of a gun would not have a problem with journalists being killed.

> “If you are an upright journalist, nothing will happen to you,” said Duterte

Good. So we can rest assured that only those journalists that were not 'upright' will not remain upright.

Re: Body count rises as Philippines president calls for drug addicts to be killed

#174

Post by jister »

13of40 wrote: post #155
jister wrote: post #127

DISCLAIMER: I am a Filipino and I live in the Philippines When an international media writes something without much knowledge on what's really going on it blows out of proportion. Now let me give you an idea of our situation here before the Duterte presidency. HISTORY ============== The Marcoses and Aquinos and their cronies, have brought the Philippines to its knees for decades (50 years). These families are what we…

Out of curiosity, is there any distinction being drawn between "hard" and "soft" drugs? For example, is anyone being killed for selling/using marijuana, or is it all about heroin and meth? Edit: I don't understand why someone would down vote this question. Taken at face value, the mandate to kill "drug users" could mean it's OK to shoot up a coffee shop or kill your neighbor for being an alcoholic, depending on where…

Most cases are meth related. Philippines now is like a meth capital.

Re: Body count rises as Philippines president calls for drug addicts to be killed

#175

Post by lostlogin »

jister wrote: post #172
jacquesm wrote: post #159

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, I'm just making the point that we have a judicial process because merely claiming someone is a criminal should not be enough to get them killed. OP is anonymous so I didn't see any harm in this. I don't use drugs, don't drink (pretty boring person here). > And this also brings up another question, what counts as a drug? Well, it's simple: that's the stuff the person you just killed was selling to your nephew thre…

Those related to drugs were killed during a buy-bust operation. And yes, there is judicial process but people will read more if the media highlights and writes about "extrajudicial killing" instead.

Can we assume the same rules will be applied to the whole population? Or will it just be applied to "them"?

Re: Body count rises as Philippines president calls for drug addicts to be killed

#176

Post by OoTheNigerian »

restalis wrote: post #154
OoTheNigerian wrote: post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>It's a stupid, petty argument that is continuously peddled by figures in non-Western countries as a justification for doing whatever they like. Thomas, you may not not realise you have just written a one line thesis for the justification of colonialism. "You brutes have no idea to run a society. We'll come show you how" Of course, you most likely do not think in such nasty terms however, that is the translation. You…

"Are you/your ways superior to the people that voted him to do EXACTLY what he is doing?" Yes, people might have supported him to get results in a serious matter, but people did not (and neither they had the competence to) specify the details. Could he instead tell the masses to rattle out the drug dealers and the junkies so the law enforcement could apprehended them for future trials? No, here was a call for mass mu…

He was clear with his methods BEFORE electios https://www.theguardian.com/world/2016/may/09/philippines-el...

Not the usual bait and switch.

Like was pointed out, drug dealers are free to surrender. And some have done so.

http://news.abs-cbn.com/news/07/09/16/thousands-of-drug-push...

My own gripe is pontification of the west when it comes to the business of other countries.

Re: Body count rises as Philippines president calls for drug addicts to be killed

#177

Post by jacquesm »

jister wrote: post #172
jacquesm wrote: post #159

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, I'm just making the point that we have a judicial process because merely claiming someone is a criminal should not be enough to get them killed. OP is anonymous so I didn't see any harm in this. I don't use drugs, don't drink (pretty boring person here). > And this also brings up another question, what counts as a drug? Well, it's simple: that's the stuff the person you just killed was selling to your nephew thre…

Those related to drugs were killed during a buy-bust operation. And yes, there is judicial process but people will read more if the media highlights and writes about "extrajudicial killing" instead.

> Those related to drugs were killed during a buy-bust operation.

In a country where the police is as corrupt as yours the last thing you want is to by-pass due process.

That pretty much guarantees that lots of opponents of the newly elected regime will suddenly find themselves on the receiving end in 'buy-bust' operations.

> And yes, there is judicial process

I find that hard to square with

> Those related to drugs were killed during a buy-bust operation.

Re: Body count rises as Philippines president calls for drug addicts to be killed

#178

Post by jacquesm »

OoTheNigerian wrote: post #162
jacquesm wrote: post #111

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's a local affair as far as I'm concerned. But you're taking issue with us on our 'high horses' criticizing it and that should be respected. People have voted for dumb things many times in the past, in my opinion this is one of those times. Might or majority do not automatically make right. If you 'clean up' a city or a country by extra-judicial killings that makes the cure no better than the disease. If the coun…

I'm merely criticizing your criticism (the loop goes on). I didn't say you did not have the right to criticize. People declare others who win stupid while claiming to to be democrats. That is hypocrisy. While I similarly think people are stupid, I am not a fan of popular democracy. I believe my position is consistent with my belief. I am criticizing the hypocrisy of being democrat only when you get what you want. Jus…

Democracy is far from perfect. So it is perfectly ok to use democracy but to always be suspicious of that which gets decided democratically.

That's not hypocrisy, it is simply the best adaptation to reality that I can come up with.

And it has nothing to do with 'getting what I want', if NL will vote massively for Wilders in the next election (our local light-weight populist get-rid-of-all-Islamists-and-our-problems-will-magically-disappear politician) then I will consider that a failure of democracy.

Not because I don't get 'what I want' but because it will likely cause great harm to my country.

Re: Body count rises as Philippines president calls for drug addicts to be killed

#179

Post by oblio »

herbst wrote: post #96
oblio wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So the solution is to allow people to kill random strangers and then claim that they killed an addict? Or even better, they will kill competitors/people they don't like and then claim that they killed an addict.

That's exactly what every big war nation does, except usually OUTSIDE their own country, with people they have no relation with. Not saying it's good, but if a country decides to kill its own people to fix some problems, that is somehow suddenly a huge topic while other nations invade other countries and kill more civilians than terrorists?

The thing you're mentioning is also a huge discussion topic and widely disapproved when it happens.

So your point is kind of irrelevant.

Re: Body count rises as Philippines president calls for drug addicts to be killed

#180

Post by oblio »

kimmshibal wrote: post #67
oblio wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So the solution is to allow people to kill random strangers and then claim that they killed an addict? Or even better, they will kill competitors/people they don't like and then claim that they killed an addict.

Why you say they will kill random stranger? They kill an addict. Prisons don't have space anymore because gov don't have budget. You are welcome to go to my country and get mug by them. Your view will change.

Who will verify that the person they killed is truly an addict and not the CEO of a company competing with the killer's company or the killer's wife secret lover?

There's a reason each country has an official justice system.

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