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Body count rises as Philippines president calls for drug addicts to be killed

asiancorrespondent.com

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Re: Body count rises as Philippines president calls for drug addicts to be killed

#151

Post by jacquesm »

jister wrote: post #127

DISCLAIMER: I am a Filipino and I live in the Philippines When an international media writes something without much knowledge on what's really going on it blows out of proportion. Now let me give you an idea of our situation here before the Duterte presidency. HISTORY ============== The Marcoses and Aquinos and their cronies, have brought the Philippines to its knees for decades (50 years). These families are what we…

You're the guy I bought drugs from on my last trip through your country. What makes you believe that you will escape the dance this time?

Re: Body count rises as Philippines president calls for drug addicts to be killed

#152

Post by tajen »

pedalpete wrote: post #84
OoTheNigerian wrote: post #43

As usual, mostly western commentators sitting on their high horses pointing and pontificating with no idea of local context or understanding. First of all, Duterte was elected overwhelmingly with a clear mandate of using brute violence to clear out drug dealers. He was clear about it and he is delivering on that mandate. I have to accept, he has made a PR error by not calling them terrorists. At which point, he will…

Ok, let's look at this on an even playing field, which should be very doable with the atrocities befalling the US and somewhat indiscriminate killing of African Americans. Note: I'm not American and don't live in the US. African Americans have been killed by police, imprisoned as almost a racial policy (often resulting from petty drug offenses). So let's say there are an equal number of people killed on each side. 30…

> Why is USA better? It is attempting to face the tragedy and stop the killing.

Is America attempting to stop the killing? I must have missed a chapter. Last time I've checked Obama was mourning the police officers who were killed and no national mourning was declared for the 500-600 corpses left by the police. And last time I've checked there is also still no trial for which Arabs get to die in Middle East under drone strikes. And 95% inmates in USA have used a plea bargain, which means no trial has occurd to prove whether they were guilty or not. Did I mention the Civil Asset Forfeiture program? Did I mention that even if we right the 3 examples above, the financial imbalance means that the poorer people are not properly representated in legal situations, in votes, and in the economy?

I'm flummoxed the we, in the age of the full information, still take USA as a mere candidate when we talk about human rights. We can't compare USA to anything, their track record is too low.

Re: Body count rises as Philippines president calls for drug addicts to be killed

#153

Post by nl »

cocotino wrote: post #132
jacquesm wrote: post #121

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> History has proven that doing away with all the uncivilised people makes a society better. Citation fairly urgently needed. Does that mean we will have to get rid of the killers as well? They're uncivilized people as well, after all. > Even if a few innocents die. Ah, that's too bad. > To make an omelette you have to break some eggs. You've got to be kidding.

>Citation fairly urgently needed. Think of African or American colonisation for example. Local opposition had to be removed. Think of the war on drugs in the USA, which was a covert operation to kill blacks. Etc >Does that mean we will have to get rid of the killers as well? They're uncivilized people as well, after all. No they are not. They earned the right to kill drug lords and junkies through democracy. With all…

>>> History has proven that doing away with all the uncivilised people makes a society better.

>> Citation fairly urgently needed

> colonisation for example. Local opposition had to be removed. Think of the war on drugs in the USA, which was a covert operation to kill blacks.

Umm.. I'm assuming I'm misreading this. It sounds like you have just claimed that colonisation and an operation to kill blacks in the US were both ways to do away with uncivilised people and make society better(?!?). What did you mean?

Re: Body count rises as Philippines president calls for drug addicts to be killed

#154

Post by restalis »

OoTheNigerian wrote: post #97
thomasfoster96 wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The fact is, you do not get radical progress pandering to western styled hypocritical democracy or "human rights". It the reality. A harsh one. So what's the progress towards then? A totalitarian dictatorship that murders people? That's hardly progress of any sort. I'm quite happy to stay on my high horse if that means arguing for the rule of law and basic decency, both things which Duterte has thrown out the windo…

>It's a stupid, petty argument that is continuously peddled by figures in non-Western countries as a justification for doing whatever they like. Thomas, you may not not realise you have just written a one line thesis for the justification of colonialism. "You brutes have no idea to run a society. We'll come show you how" Of course, you most likely do not think in such nasty terms however, that is the translation. You…

"Are you/your ways superior to the people that voted him to do EXACTLY what he is doing?"

Yes, people might have supported him to get results in a serious matter, but people did not (and neither they had the competence to) specify the details. Could he instead tell the masses to rattle out the drug dealers and the junkies so the law enforcement could apprehended them for future trials? No, here was a call for mass murder, plain and simple! Do the killers have to prove that the killed were drug dealers? Are the killers known at all? (You know, to be hold accountable if it happens that their victims had nothing to do with drugs?) We're talking about the difference in the means to the same desired end of drug problem. An important difference!

Re: Body count rises as Philippines president calls for drug addicts to be killed

#155

Post by 13of40 »

jister wrote: post #127

DISCLAIMER: I am a Filipino and I live in the Philippines When an international media writes something without much knowledge on what's really going on it blows out of proportion. Now let me give you an idea of our situation here before the Duterte presidency. HISTORY ============== The Marcoses and Aquinos and their cronies, have brought the Philippines to its knees for decades (50 years). These families are what we…

Out of curiosity, is there any distinction being drawn between "hard" and "soft" drugs? For example, is anyone being killed for selling/using marijuana, or is it all about heroin and meth?

Edit: I don't understand why someone would down vote this question. Taken at face value, the mandate to kill "drug users" could mean it's OK to shoot up a coffee shop or kill your neighbor for being an alcoholic, depending on where your particular culture draws the line. For example, https://www.theguardian.com/world/2012/jun/25/iranian-pair-d...

Re: Body count rises as Philippines president calls for drug addicts to be killed

#156

Post by lostlogin »

jacquesm wrote: post #151
jister wrote: post #127

DISCLAIMER: I am a Filipino and I live in the Philippines When an international media writes something without much knowledge on what's really going on it blows out of proportion. Now let me give you an idea of our situation here before the Duterte presidency. HISTORY ============== The Marcoses and Aquinos and their cronies, have brought the Philippines to its knees for decades (50 years). These families are what we…

You're the guy I bought drugs from on my last trip through your country. What makes you believe that you will escape the dance this time?

Did you actually? And this also brings up another question, what counts as a drug?

Re: Body count rises as Philippines president calls for drug addicts to be killed

#158

Post by joe5150 »

croon wrote: post #87
joe5150 wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

this is not remotely like voting for Trump. and it doesn't "so happen" that life is easier in countries with functioning (if deeply flawed) justice systems than it is in ones where corruption and vigilantism rule; there are pretty good reasons for why that is.

You expressed two opinions opposing the statement of parent. You expressed no reasoning behind those opinions.

okay, thanks!

Re: Body count rises as Philippines president calls for drug addicts to be killed

#159

Post by jacquesm »

lostlogin wrote: post #156
jacquesm wrote: post #151

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're the guy I bought drugs from on my last trip through your country. What makes you believe that you will escape the dance this time?

Did you actually? And this also brings up another question, what counts as a drug?

No, I'm just making the point that we have a judicial process because merely claiming someone is a criminal should not be enough to get them killed. OP is anonymous so I didn't see any harm in this.

I don't use drugs, don't drink (pretty boring person here).

> And this also brings up another question, what counts as a drug?

Well, it's simple: that's the stuff the person you just killed was selling to your nephew three weeks ago.

Re: Body count rises as Philippines president calls for drug addicts to be killed

#160

Post by mcbits »

kbart wrote: post #65
tux3 wrote: post #49

An attempt to kill a whole subset of the population, this is genocide, isn't it? It might be appropriate to refer this lovely gentleman to the International Criminal Court.

No, it's not. Genocide has a clearly defined meaning[1]: "Genocide is the intentional action to systematically eliminate an ethnic, national, racial, or religious group" 1. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Genocide

The "geno" literally means a race or lineage of people. If the definition can be expanded to include national and religious affiliation, then it might as well be expanded to include other social groups. It's the act that's atrocious, regardless of semantic technicalities.
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