Earlier quoted context omitted.
Maybe they did or will do that. I'm not privy to any of the inner workings of this case. If you are then maybe you could share those details. I simple said it is possible he is biased and suggesting so is not racist.
No, saying he is incapable of being an impartial judge because he is of mexican descent is racist. full stop. So either he is fit to be a judge and is capable of being impartial or he isnt. by the way Trumps attorney has said publicly that they will not seek to have the judge removed from the case. Actions speak louder than words.
Trump
331–340 of 394 posts
Re: Trump
#332Earlier quoted context omitted.
No, saying he is incapable of being an impartial judge because he is of mexican descent is racist. full stop. So either he is fit to be a judge and is capable of being impartial or he isnt. by the way Trumps attorney has said publicly that they will not seek to have the judge removed from the case. Actions speak louder than words.
So.... is it racist for people to say white judges are being harsher on non-white defendants? Because in that scenario, it is usually the white judges that are viewed as being a problem. I don't see any difference here. Full stop.
That depends on the basis of the claim. If its based on presumptions about group identity and how that will produce actions, then yes. If it is based on systematic gathering of data on judicial decisions, factual circumstances which cover the expected non-race inputs to those decisions, and information of about defendants' and judges' races, then, no.
Re: Trump
#333Earlier quoted context omitted.
If the judge is acting in a manner unfit of a US judge, why dont trumps lawyers file for a recusal of the judge, or any other various legal methods of assigning a different judge to the case? Can you show any evidence that the judge has acted in a manner unfit of his judicial duty? Or that the case lead to outcomes that were harsher than the norm for such a decision?
Maybe they did or will do that. I'm not privy to any of the inner workings of this case. If you are then maybe you could share those details. I simple said it is possible he is biased and suggesting so is not racist.
Trump has directly said that the judge must be biased, because of his ethnic heritage and the supposed "fact" (which isn't actually a fact, but anyway) that Trump is "building a wall" -- that is, the claim actually being made by Trump is that it is impossible for any person of Mexican heritage to not be biased against Trump because of Trump's specific policy stances.
Re: Trump
#334Earlier quoted context omitted.
> He said that a judge of Mexican descent isn't treating him fairly, and that it is probably because of his heritage. The judge is an _American_ of Mexican ethnicity. Trump said that the judge gave unfair rulings because of the judge's ethnicity. Trump is advocating that ethnicity "trumps" citizenship, judicial duty, or any other personal and professional virtues. As Paul Ryan correctly noted this kind of essentialis…
When a judge joins a group called LaRaza "the race", a violent mexican affiliated group that burns american flags and wants to return California to Mexico then maybe, just maybe race does have something to do with the ideas that this judge espouses and hence why that judge's race SEEMINGLY influences his decisions. Surely not even you think that Trump is an actual racist, as in: he thinks mexicans are worth less as h…
> Surely not even you think that Trump is an actual racist, as in: he thinks mexicans are worth less as human beings purely for being mexican.
He's never said anything like that so I don't think he's a frothing at the mouth racist. Based on his public statements I'd say he's a mild racist who holds some old-school prejudicial attitudes on race and gender. His attitudes were fairly normal fifty years ago.
By the same token judge Curiel has not said anything racist or prejudicial against white people in general, or against Trump in particular. He's a judge, and judges put aside their political views and apply the law fairly. They do this all the time. So it would be a stretch to say he has an anger boner against Trump.
> No, you just want to point out how he said things the "wrong" way. Well that incidentally is political correctness which is the very thing people are fed up with.
I agree that PC reactions to perceived racism/sexism/islamophobia can go overboard and obscure the truth. Such as the Sam Harris vs Ben Affleck incident.
The problem in this case Trump is basically saying "this guy hates me because he's mexican". There's no "right" way to say this. There's no deeper truth being unearthed. The judge made rulings against Trump, and Trump unloaded against the guy. This is Trump trying to save face and settle a personal score.
Re: Trump
#335>we're drowning in political correctness I'm always curious when people say this, what do they actually mean? Is there a specific thing happening that I'm not aware of here? In all seriousness, what is Sam referring to here?
Silencing other points of view. Safe spaces. Refusing to call radical Islam what it is. Just a few examples.
Mostly, I think the term "political correctness" is asinine. I've literally never met a single person who claimed to be trying to be "politically correct," I've only ever heard it used as a pejorative used to brush aside other people's opinions and concerns. Historically it mean holding the party line above reason and compassion, and was repurposed in the 1970's to mean to have "correct" political thinking. See a quote from the time "a man cannot be politically correct and a chauvinist, too." Hardly objectionable, really.
The phrase was turned around in the 90's to mean loosely "liberal bias" or "liberal concerns" Not to be confused with Neoliberalism, but rather center-left American politics.
The term has really become more of a dog whistle than anything useful or meaningful. It's mostly used in political commentary to mean that the user of the term disagrees with another party's assertion that a particularly phrase, policy, etc is the product of bigotry. For example: John makes a statement about Asian-Americans, and Mary calls the statement racist. Mark replies saying that John isn't a racist, Mary is just being politically correct. However, this is a logical fallacy, as Mark has not address the merit or content of Mary's critique.
I guess my point is that "political correctness" isn't a problem, in my view the use of the term is a lazy rhetorical device. It is used when one has no interest in engaging criticism, or doesn't like being called out on being a demagogue.
Re: Trump
#336Earlier quoted context omitted.
Please Explain. For example, he wishes to deport the families of undocumented immigrants, including children born in the United States. How is that true or legal?
I didn't know he claimed that, and I've no idea what's the law on that. But his claims that illegal immigrants are in the US illegally are true, by definition.
Re: Trump
#337Earlier quoted context omitted.
I did not. I am saying that providing a leg up to a person of color today, to offset centuries of systematic discrimination, does not represent 'discrimination against whites.' Likewise, the fact that a Chicano Judge has made decisions in the past which benefit people of color does not make him 'racist against whites.'
Well, now it's clear that you did. You just have this twisted definition of what "discrimination" and "racism" are. There's a difference between helping blacks because they're poor (as long as you also help poor whites and others), and helping blacks because they're black . The latter is by definition racism (because you're not helping whites because they're white ). For example, Obama needs no help.
As for Obama, he is ivy-league educated and probably tests higher on a standard IQ test than you or I. Despite that, people regularly insult his intelligence because he is a person of color.
I agree wholeheartedly that poor people (white or black) have a really tough time getting ahead in society and need help. However, denying the existence of systemic racism and prejudice against people of color does nothing to help anyone.
Re: Trump
#338Re: Trump
#339> kill the cancer that's causing it This guy is calling Trump supporters like myself a cancer that needs to be killed. Who's the real nazi? We need Trump to fix this country and we need it fast
We detached this subthread from https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=11940914 and marked it off-topic, and banned this account for trolling.
Disgusting...
Re: Trump
#340Earlier quoted context omitted.
It's not the potential win in November that's scary, it's the fact that Trump won (is guaranteed to win?) the nomination. If God descended from heaven and snapped his fingers and declared, "This November, you shall decide between Donald Trump and Hillary Clinton," then I wouldn't find it particularly surprising or worrying that ~50% of the electorate would support Trump. But the fact that people chose him out of a wi…
Who exactly were the establishment Republican candidates supposed to appeal to? Trump didn't attract enthusiastic supporters across party lines because they were apathetic jokesters. He may sound insane to you, but to a very large "silent majority" he is the first voice of sanity in a long time.
[citation needed]