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Is the World Ready for a Guaranteed Basic Income?

freakonomics.com

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Re: Is the World Ready for a Guaranteed Basic Income?

#51

Post by VincentEvans »

swsieber wrote: post #39
arviewer wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

According to your view, you cannot change anything ever. Take a look at microcredits. Give women in Africa $50 or $100 to start up their own business. They know exactly what to do, and it really helps. Isn't this something similar?

I think what the parent was referring to was that a universal increase of money supply basically leads to inflation. I think. I'd welcome any clarification to my attempted summary.

Yes, but i don't know whether what i observer is your standard "typical economic inflation" or some very particular phenomenon targeting the poor.

A disabled relative of mine is considering signing with Uber to lease their car (did you know Uber leases?) to make some money. After paying for gas and insurance - he is literally working slave wage. I thought this is relevant somehow.

Re: Is the World Ready for a Guaranteed Basic Income?

#52

Post by mistermann »

dota_fanatic wrote: post #29

Disclaimer: I don't know anything about anything. Some parents can put 850k in a account for their child when it's born that gets invested, say in the American economy (grows by say 7% over an average, long time period), which compounds until later in life, and when they grow up, they can access it. With good financial responsibility, this child won't have to work a day in their lives and can live off the returns. Wh…

Why only one million, why not five million?

Re: Is the World Ready for a Guaranteed Basic Income?

#53

Post by pluteoid »

maxxxxx wrote: post #40
Overtonwindow wrote: post #2

Negative. Those with money will fight like hell to keep from giving it up. However if by some chance/miracle a guaranteed income is ever instituted, it will become a political football, as politicians and advocacy groups seek to continuously push it higher and higher. Instead of a money handout, I would rather support money in exchange for public works and service. I don't believe handouts without some kind of exchan…

I also don't believe it can't work long term unless attitudes change dramatically. People who work for a low income will complain that there are people who get almost the same without doing any work. The same wealthy people who lobby for more tax cuts will also not want to pay for people who don't do anything. There will be a lot of people who will use the freedom granted by basic income for productive means but ther…

The people working for only slightly more than the UBI will get more than twice the income of someone not working at all. Universal basic income means everyone gets the income.

Re: Is the World Ready for a Guaranteed Basic Income?

#54

Post by maxerickson »

branchless wrote: post #46
TTPrograms wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If all rents rise jointly that primarily indicates that housing is not competing on price, so remedying that anti-competitive environment is a separate and more important issue IMO.

I don't understand the thinking here. Rents are set by what the market can bear. Make more money available and the price will increase.

rayiner mentions mobility in a cousin comment. In a healthy housing market, rents should roughly match the price of new construction (plus some profit) rather than being set just by the existing supply.

Re: Is the World Ready for a Guaranteed Basic Income?

#56

Post by strommen »

VincentEvans wrote: post #23

Why wouldn't all standard of living benefits of basic income get eliminated immediately by all relevant costs rising to soak it up? This happens every single time the poor get any sort of money. In poor neighborhoods the rents cost as much as people are able to pay, no more, no less. Do you know when most rental deposits are collected? Around the tax return season. If suddenly the poor had some money to spare - the r…

> In poor neighborhoods the rents cost as much as people are able to pay, no more, no less.

This is a bit of a tautology. Low-rent housing is usually pretty bad, so when people can afford to pay more they just move to a nicer place.

As far as I know, the first-time home buyer credit made a tiny ripple in the low-end housing market - where did prices "balloon"? College education is quite different because the "market" has a massive barrier to entry (in terms of creating a new university).

Re: Is the World Ready for a Guaranteed Basic Income?

#57

Post by ancap »

f_allwein wrote: post #17

It is important to consider this as more and more white-collar jobs may become redundant due to automation [e.g. 1]. Moreover, it would be interesting to see what becomes of today's jobs if there were an basic income. E.g. what percentage of jobs would disappear and not be missed? How many people would continue to work at their current job? [1] http://books.simonandschuster.com/The-Industries-of-the-Futu...

Why? We have had "automation" in some form or another for many millennia and we have not needed a "basic income".

Every technological advancement from the invention of hand tools, to creating complex machines can be loosely classified as "automation" and in every case the standard of living has increased and resources were then allocated to some more productive means.

Why is today's automation any different?

Re: Is the World Ready for a Guaranteed Basic Income?

#58

Post by dota_fanatic »

wskinner wrote: post #43
dota_fanatic wrote: post #29

Disclaimer: I don't know anything about anything. Some parents can put 850k in a account for their child when it's born that gets invested, say in the American economy (grows by say 7% over an average, long time period), which compounds until later in life, and when they grow up, they can access it. With good financial responsibility, this child won't have to work a day in their lives and can live off the returns. Wh…

What makes you think the American economy would continue growing at 7% forever? And why do you believe prices wouldn't rise to meet the new common standard of living afforded by this grant?

Because humans will never stop climbing. It's built into us. Even most people in poverty want to climb, they just have little to no options, so they find ways to cope nevertheless.

As for rising prices, surely they can't rise everywhere? People will be able to afford to abandon the obscenely wealthy playpens (SF, NY, Tokyo, etc) and move somewhere that's affordable. Cost of living varies depending on location, doesn't it? Surely this would result in more competition, not less?

Re: Is the World Ready for a Guaranteed Basic Income?

#59

Post by prodmerc »

lghh wrote: post #42
mrfusion wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Inside every person, silly.

If I had a decent basic income, I wouldn't be working.

You wouldn't? What would you be doing?

If I had basic income that pays for everyday expenses, I'd be free to learn something (robotics/automation/mechanical engineering) and find a job in that industry...

Re: Is the World Ready for a Guaranteed Basic Income?

#60

Post by ryandvm »

dota_fanatic wrote: post #29

Disclaimer: I don't know anything about anything. Some parents can put 850k in a account for their child when it's born that gets invested, say in the American economy (grows by say 7% over an average, long time period), which compounds until later in life, and when they grow up, they can access it. With good financial responsibility, this child won't have to work a day in their lives and can live off the returns. Wh…

Good luck growing the economy at 7% when your population has a 100% incidence rate of affluenza...
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