I’ve Had a Cyberstalker Since I Was 12 • Hacker News Board

Re: I’ve Had a Cyberstalker Since I Was 12

#161

Post by anon4 » Wed, Mar 02, 2016, 1:39 PM UTC

DanBC wrote: post #155

stevetrewick wrote: post #131

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> See the double standard No, not in real life. Wherever you live/work is fucked up if you do (academia, perchance ?). Rude men are just described as rude, often in less polite ways. I've worked bars, factories, manual labour, all the way up to board rooms and I have never once seen this particular double standard applied. I say this as someone with both a keen eye for and a near zero tolerance of prejudice and discr…

Imagine a business meeting. A person is talking, and a man interrupts and talks over that person. The person asserts themselves, and tells the interrupting man not to interrupt. That person is more likely to be seen as confident or assertive if they're a man, and more likely to be seen as shrill or bitchy if they're a woman. > I have never once seen this particular double standard applied. I say this as someone with…

Huh. I would have thought that the woman in question is assertive and putting an asshole in his place, but now that you've told me society at large thinks of her as a bitch, I'll make sure to fall in line.

Re: I’ve Had a Cyberstalker Since I Was 12

#162

Post by cplease » Wed, Mar 02, 2016, 1:51 PM UTC

notahacker wrote: post #139

cplease wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Or just telling him directly to stop himself. Maybe she did, but she didn't say she did. "Don't message me SO MUCH or I will BLOCK YOU" isn't quite the same thing as DON'T CONTACT ME AGAIN. A gentleman would get the hint, but a gentleman wouldn't be such a creepy asshole to begin with. You don't legally have the right to dictate to someone how they talk to you. You do legally have the right to cut off all contact wit…

His response to ""Don't message me SO MUCH or I will BLOCK YOU", followed by a block when the messaging remained unchanged was to file a series of nuisance complaints about her and start messaging her friends and employers. I don't think any reasonable law enforcement agency could conclude that this behaviour wasn't a problem because she hadn't asked him to stop.

There's no question that his behavior was "problematic." What is not at all clear in that scenario is whether or not it was unlawful for him to continue to communicate with her. "So much" literally means there is an acceptable amount of communications. Blocking on Facebook is a completely passive action which does not directly communicate anything. Sure you can deduce that she didn't want to hear from him again, but she should have sent an unhedged message to cease and desist further contact, THEN block him.

Re: I’ve Had a Cyberstalker Since I Was 12

#163

Post by Practicality » Wed, Mar 02, 2016, 2:24 PM UTC

marincounty wrote: post #144

cgriswald wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've found they also have an amazing ability to make excuses for the behaviors of others. I had an ex who got into a lot of sketchy situations because she refused to believe people were exactly who they were telling her they were. Guys would do inappropriate things that clearly bothered her, but she would claim they were "joking" or believe she misunderstood, etc. etc. So she wouldn't set any boundaries, and of cours…

I had one of those gems too. I now have a deviated septum. It was in my thirties, and she was hot. When I realized she went into situations looking for drama; I finally told her to get lost. I was drinking pretty heavily when I was dating her. I thought she was this misunderstood goth chick. Well, when I stopped drinking, I saw the sutle cues she was giving out. The little coy looks, while I was getting drinks. Activ…

While this has definitely gotten off topic, I appreciate your story. I hope writing about it was therapeutic.

Re: I’ve Had a Cyberstalker Since I Was 12

#164

Post by pitay » Wed, Mar 02, 2016, 2:46 PM UTC

varjag wrote: post #159

jeppew wrote: post #127

Earlier quoted context omitted.

well to take your question a bit literally, men have quite a long history of being pressured into soldiering. First thing that hit my mind when i read your question: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/White_feather

You of course realize that this was the same kind of social conditioning and gender role pressure that the grandparent post is downplaying?

No, the grandparent post was saying that men were similarly influenced by societal pressures. It wasn't downplaying the societal pressure.

Re: I’ve Had a Cyberstalker Since I Was 12

#165

Post by LordKano » Wed, Mar 02, 2016, 2:58 PM UTC

So...

Why didn't she just give him a firm, but polite "I'm not interested"?

I'm not saying that stalking and/or harassment are acceptable. I'm just saying that she probably could have avoided 14 years of misery if she had just politely told the guy that there was no potential for anything more.

Women need to learn to reject people in whom they're not interested. They think they're being "nice" or at the very least, being "not mean" but they are being incredibly cruel by letting the other person think there's hope when there isn't.

Don't expect him to take the hint. Tell him directly.

Re: I’ve Had a Cyberstalker Since I Was 12

#166

Post by openasocket » Wed, Mar 02, 2016, 2:58 PM UTC

facepalm wrote: post #118

btilly wrote: post #64

Yeah, it sucks, but no surprise. Stalking is an old, old problem. And the police won't do anything until it turns violent. You can stalk normal people, movie stars, business people - pretty much anyone other than a psychiatrist. (It turns out that psychiatrists have a really easy time getting their stalkers committed to insane asylums.) I know a woman who owns nothing in her own name, changes her phone number frequen…

Can't people be put into a psychiatric ward at some point?

You can only be committed against your will if a mental health professional determines you to be an active risk to yourself or others. The key point there is that you have to be evaluated by a mental health professional: and it's not like there are psychologists roaming the streets evaluating strangers. There are only a couple of scenarios that can result in being evaluated: voluntarily (i.e. seeing a therapist) or by some sort of court mandate (if a person accused of a crime displays signs of mental illness, often a forensic psychologist will be asked to evaluate them). Basically getting a stalker committed requires getting them charged with a crime or in some way in front of a judge.

Also keep in mind the bar for committing someone against their will is pretty high. For instance, a person with schizophrenia who is homeless and spends their days talking to voices in their head has a very poor quality of life and is likely to die due to disease, starvation or exposure, but is not suicidal and thus cannot be committed, at least not long term. Sometimes that person can be committed for a few days for evaluation and observation, but no longer.

Re: I’ve Had a Cyberstalker Since I Was 12

#167

Post by oldmanjay » Wed, Mar 02, 2016, 3:02 PM UTC

JulianMorrison wrote: post #138

dracht wrote: post #121

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How many women can physically dominate an average man?

Humans aren't averages. A randomly chosen woman will almost always have some fraction of men out there she can physically dominate. And some women are just plain tough and could physically impose on nearly all men. And yet men don't worry and walk faster when the woman they're alone with in the parking lot looks like she could bench a truck.

I'm not certain what your point was intended to be, but human men are far stronger than human women with very rare exception. A randomly chosen women is unlikely to be able to physically dominate any man at all, absent deformity. The difference is quite stark.

Certainly a highly trained female body builder is an exception, but they are also vanishingly rare in the population and very unlikely to be randomly chosen.

Sorry. This is one area that feminism doesn't cover with its hypothesis of equality.

Re: I’ve Had a Cyberstalker Since I Was 12

#168

Post by untothebreach » Wed, Mar 02, 2016, 3:02 PM UTC

ryanlol wrote: post #129

btilly wrote: post #93

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Oh, she got specific advice about restraining orders. The specific advice was, "The point at which a stalker is likely to flip out is the point where it becomes obvious to the stalker that the attention is unwanted and the relationship can never work. There is a real possibility that the act of taking out a restraining order will trigger a murder-suicide." When you're dealing with insane people, you can't expect a sa…

At that point, why not just buy a gun and start going to a shooting range? Most US jurisdictions have a legal framework that enables you to kill others in self-defense. I don't personally believe that anyone should have to do this, but I also believe that if you feel sufficiently threatened it'd be silly to ignore your legal right to self-defense.

Any decent self-defense instructor will tell you that the best way to win a fight is to not get into a fight at all. So why do something to encourage violence? Let's say you do get a gun, you go to a shooting range, you get good at shooting it. Who's to say that, when the stalker shows up at your door, you're going to be able to pull the trigger? Taking a life is not an easy thing to do, and in the "heat of the moment" some people can be unwilling to do it, even when doing so would save themselves from harm.

Re: I’ve Had a Cyberstalker Since I Was 12

#169

Post by andreasvc » Wed, Mar 02, 2016, 3:03 PM UTC

LordKano wrote: post #165

So... Why didn't she just give him a firm, but polite "I'm not interested"? I'm not saying that stalking and/or harassment are acceptable. I'm just saying that she probably could have avoided 14 years of misery if she had just politely told the guy that there was no potential for anything more. Women need to learn to reject people in whom they're not interested. They think they're being "nice" or at the very least, b…

You're blaming the victim. Do you really believe she didn't tell him no clearly?

> Women need to learn to reject people in whom they're not interested

No, that's not the problem, women get plenty of experience with that. People should not stalk or harass, period.

Re: I’ve Had a Cyberstalker Since I Was 12

#170

Post by TACIXAT » Wed, Mar 02, 2016, 3:05 PM UTC

btilly wrote: post #93

jsmthrowaway wrote: post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> And the police won't do anything until it turns violent. Try violating a restraining order taken out against you and see if you maintain that opinion. The behavior you describe as well as that of the article qualifies for seeking a restraining order, which this entire discussion seems to have forgotten is in existence. Once you have a EPO/TRO/PRO, then the police care when it is violated. A lot . It's easy for them…

Oh, she got specific advice about restraining orders. The specific advice was, "The point at which a stalker is likely to flip out is the point where it becomes obvious to the stalker that the attention is unwanted and the relationship can never work. There is a real possibility that the act of taking out a restraining order will trigger a murder-suicide." When you're dealing with insane people, you can't expect a sa…

Wow, what horrible advice. It might escalate if you get a restraining order? Yea, no shit, but then they can also go to jail. If someone is harassing you, silence is not the solution.

A bully might beat you up if you tell someone what they are doing, but it will more likely get you the help you need.

Maybe not for your specific situation but that is really bad advice for victims. Speak up, take action.