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Freenode sucks

bramcohen.livejournal.com

61–69 of 69 posts

Re: Freenode sucks

#61
post #19
post #9

6 months? That's pretty lame, and I'd be a bit peeved as well. Having to go through that entire process of re-registering, etc, just to get an account back and admin'ing that group? I'm glad this isn't a global policy on email addresses or website registrations!

Actually, it's 60 days.

If you become a supporter and give a donation for the service, you can keep your nick even if you don't log in. So, instead of complaining about a free service, he could have made a tax-deductible donation and not had any of these problems. Alas, lots of "could haves" in this whole episode.

Re: Freenode sucks

#62

Bram Cohen's Aspergers is well-publicized ( http://www.businessweek.com/magazine/content/08_43/b41050468... ) and essential context for anything you read about/by him.

[deleted]

Re: Freenode sucks

#64
There is a lesson Bram needs to learn. If you wish to avoid being considered a 'douche' you have to better optimise your statements to undermine your oponent and remove their credibility. He could have posted a factual account of his unpleasant experiences with Freenode that included a sincere warning to any other organisers of official projects. Instead he overemphasised the importance of showing both sides of the story.

If you are going to be negative then it is important to do it well and do it ruthlessly. Don't try to be fair or direct. Play to the crowd and ruthlessly take the moral high ground or it will be taken from you, as is the case here. It is a little ironic but if Bram had been more of a Machiavellian 'meanie' then he would not have been been labeled a 'meanie'. Some of the posts here provide good advice on ways he could have done that.

It seems clear that Bram's misfortune warrants a warning for all potential users of the Freenode servers. Hopefully this is not missed due to Bram's neglect of political expediency.

Re: Freenode sucks

#65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You were a total douche about it. The other guy was actually a bit polite and helpful. >People are free to criticize me for not being polite, and I'm free to respond that they're being petty and superficial. This is you not getting it, possibly because you have Aspergers. edit: Actually, fuck that. You're functional enough to understand what you're doing.

I didn't have any opinion of him as a person (yes I appreciate his work), until I saw him spouting off about being important. Now I have a negative opinion of his personality. The whole aspergers thing is based on a self-diagnosis and the only reason he wouldn't get diagnosed is out of fear not having it. P.S. Somebody stole my nick, where can I cry about it?

``P.S. Somebody stole my nick, where can I cry about it?''

Please learn to read. He is complaining about a policy he wasn't warned about, a policy that _doesn't_ involve warning the user of upcoming expiry, and finally, that doesn't in any way seem to take into account channel ownership.

It's a bad protocol. That's all.

Re: Freenode sucks

#66

So, I'm not "one of the most well known and respected people in the whole open source community" and I'm not as socially inept as Bram, but I, too, had some issues getting things done on FreeNode, and I sympathize with his frustration. The #webmin channel had been claimed by someone unrelated to the project, and who we had no prior contact with; it wasn't a hostile thing, but they hadn't logged in for months, weren't…

Look up Asperger's.

Re: Freenode sucks

#67

So, I'm not "one of the most well known and respected people in the whole open source community" and I'm not as socially inept as Bram, but I, too, had some issues getting things done on FreeNode, and I sympathize with his frustration. The #webmin channel had been claimed by someone unrelated to the project, and who we had no prior contact with; it wasn't a hostile thing, but they hadn't logged in for months, weren't…

Look up Asperger's.

I'm familiar with the term. It's my understanding that face-to-face communications are the most impacted areas of human interaction for folks with this condition, and that online communications are easier for them, because they're on mostly equal footing with the folks they're talking to (no one can see anybodies facial expressions on the net, and so only the words themselves matter). It's one of the reasons so many of them find their way into computing and other fields that don't require direct human interaction. With Bram's intelligence, I'm certain he would be capable of effectively simulating normal human interactions online (and I've spoken to him online and he seemed perfectly normal, though he probably wasn't in a frustrated mental state at the time). He could have chosen to approach things with more civility, regardless of whether he has Asperger's or some other condition that makes human interaction in the real world difficult. The loosely realtime nature of IRC allows time for thinking over what you're saying, considering the implications, and thinking through how it will appear to others.

In short, I'm saying that I don't think Bram should get (or would be right to expect) a pass for being an asshole to a volunteer on FreeNode, regardless of whether he has Asperger's or not. Being an asshole isn't OK, even if you have a condition that makes it easier to be one without noticing. It just means you need to be more mindful of your behavior, since it's no one else's job to do it for you.

Re: Freenode sucks

#68

So, I'm not "one of the most well known and respected people in the whole open source community" and I'm not as socially inept as Bram, but I, too, had some issues getting things done on FreeNode, and I sympathize with his frustration. The #webmin channel had been claimed by someone unrelated to the project, and who we had no prior contact with; it wasn't a hostile thing, but they hadn't logged in for months, weren't…

good excuse to hup a screen somewhere and camp the nick. eom.

Re: Freenode sucks

#69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Look up Asperger's.

I'm familiar with the term. It's my understanding that face-to-face communications are the most impacted areas of human interaction for folks with this condition, and that online communications are easier for them, because they're on mostly equal footing with the folks they're talking to (no one can see anybodies facial expressions on the net, and so only the words themselves matter). It's one of the reasons so many…

While some people with Asperger's experience problems with face to face communications and have an easier time dealing with people online, that's a sweeping statement.

I know Bram and I don't think he would care if I said that face to face communication is not a problem for him. In my time speaking with Bram both face to face and online, his primary characteristic per Asperger's has been a near complete lack of social fear.

Most humans get nervous in certain social situations. Bram does not. This will certainly cause problems when faced with someone that social might wield power, as an administrator, and Bram my have to pay for his lack of decorum in these situations.

I'm not excusing Bram's behavior. There is no need to excuse it. It has happened and he will pay whatever price is exacted. I'm simply explaining it.

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