" and I hope you realize that you just completely pissed off one of the most well known and respected people in the whole open source community" Funny thing about respect, is it takes a while to build up and can be lost in a heartbeat. edit: what's interesting is how respectful the freenode admin was throughout this whole transcript. If anything, kudos to freenode.
Are you saying you think the policy of expiring nicks after 60 days is a great idea? And the # channels are not to be used unless you fill out a form and wait 6 months? I'm kinda biased, but I think some of the policies are borderline insane. We're sort of used to registering something, and it being there a few months later if we need it. I don't see why you need to delete peoples registrations if they have been on h…
Freenode sucks
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Re: Freenode sucks
#22" and I hope you realize that you just completely pissed off one of the most well known and respected people in the whole open source community" Funny thing about respect, is it takes a while to build up and can be lost in a heartbeat. edit: what's interesting is how respectful the freenode admin was throughout this whole transcript. If anything, kudos to freenode.
While it's true that Cohen acts like a bit of a douche, I think his point is rock solid. 60 days expiration for lack of use is ridiculous. And the admin he spoke to may have stayed polite, but his glib refusal to do anything to solve an obvious problem, while endlessly reciting some BS rules out of some FAQ somewhere as if they were unbreakable laws of physics, is a terribly attitude and reminds me of the most disint…
"acts like a bit of a douche" is a huge understatement; trying to use your popularity like that is just downright ridiculous...
Re: Freenode sucks
#23A better title would have been 'Bram Cohen loses Freenode nick, complains' as generally articles here take the title from the link where possible and try not to editorialize when it isn't. ...but it would probably be better still if Internet drama was kept as far away from HN as possible.
It would be interesting to hear other hacker's feelings before we decide what is best for the community.
Re: Freenode sucks
#24Re: Freenode sucks
#25The #webmin channel had been claimed by someone unrelated to the project, and who we had no prior contact with; it wasn't a hostile thing, but they hadn't logged in for months, weren't dealing with trolls and had opened access to the topic to everyone (so the topic was being abused for all sorts of ridiculous stuff). We were unable to contact the person directly, so I tried taking over ownership of the channel through the official means. After a year of just waiting (because I'd been warned it was a very slow process, and I don't spend a lot of time in IRC these days), I chimed in on the operators channel, and spoke with a couple of folks. All were nice, friendly folks, but weren't able or willing to do anything about solving our problems with the channel. I believe in the end I was told that our application would be brought to the front of the queue because of the ongoing problems, and how long we'd been waiting. I don't know what, if anything, happened with that; it was at least 8 months ago. I never heard anything about it, anyway, and the last time I logged in, I don't think we had ops on #webmin.
So, Bram is a bit of a douche. This is pretty well-known; anyone that has ever met him or interacted with him knows that socially he is inept (and Asperger's gets bandied about as the reason, though I don't think that really accounts for lack of online social graces). I look past it because intellectually he's brilliant, and ethically he seems solid, so two out of three aint bad; in short, he means well, but he can be mean about it. Even in terms of helping people, within the limits of his social graces, he is generous with his time in helping folks use and understand his code. We all have our flaws, and the FreeNode processes and policies and lack of staff to deal appropriately with those process and policies can frustrate someone with the patience of Job. Bram definitely does not have the patience of Job.
So, to sum up: A 60 day expiry on accounts is idiotic. The official channel registration process, while well-meaning, is baroque and seems to leave a lot of channels in a lurch of having no operator or an abusive operator for months or years. Bram is kind of an asshole. But we still like FreeNode and we still like Bram.
Re: Freenode sucks
#26You act like a douche, you should be treated like a douche; "essential context" of suffering from Asperger syndrome or otherwise.
Re: Freenode sucks
#27Bram Cohen's Aspergers is well-publicized ( http://www.businessweek.com/magazine/content/08_43/b41050468... ) and essential context for anything you read about/by him.
Re: Freenode sucks
#28Earlier quoted context omitted.
Are you saying you think the policy of expiring nicks after 60 days is a great idea? And the # channels are not to be used unless you fill out a form and wait 6 months? I'm kinda biased, but I think some of the policies are borderline insane. We're sort of used to registering something, and it being there a few months later if we need it. I don't see why you need to delete peoples registrations if they have been on h…
I specifically made zero comments on freenode's policy. My comment was specifically about Bram's demeanor and his interactions with the admin. I realize that he's good at what he does and contributed a lot, but it's like seeing someone being awfully rude to a waiter, it just gives you a sense of who they are as a person. You can tell a lot about a person at how they handle the inanity of everyday life, like for insta…
Re: Freenode sucks
#29Bram Cohen's Aspergers is well-publicized ( http://www.businessweek.com/magazine/content/08_43/b41050468... ) and essential context for anything you read about/by him.
Self-diagnosis. Are you fucking kidding me?
Just because you were picked on in highschool and are a huge pain in the ass to work with, doesn't mean you have Aspergers.
Guess what, Bram Cohen's probably just an asshole who writes good software.
Re: Freenode sucks
#30" and I hope you realize that you just completely pissed off one of the most well known and respected people in the whole open source community" Funny thing about respect, is it takes a while to build up and can be lost in a heartbeat. edit: what's interesting is how respectful the freenode admin was throughout this whole transcript. If anything, kudos to freenode.