Philips Hue blocks 3rd party lights • Hacker News Board

Re: Philips Hue blocks 3rd party lights

#81

Post by DannyBee » Mon, Dec 14, 2015, 10:05 PM UTC

jcromartie wrote: post #20

Are there grounds for a lawsuit when a manufacturer pushes out an update to a product that intentionally degrades its feature set like this? This is no longer the same product that these users bought, it's effectively damaged by the update.

Generally, the agreements you agreed to allow them to do this. Those agreements tend to be held valid (despite what folks want to happen ;p)

If someone you bought it from made implied warranties around this, you may be able to sue them (They often cannot disclaim implied warranties in consumer transactions)

Re: Philips Hue blocks 3rd party lights

#82

Post by supercanuck » Mon, Dec 14, 2015, 10:05 PM UTC

AndrewKemendo wrote: post #72

mdip wrote: post #35

I'll never understand why companies make such customer hostile decisions. I can't see any upside to this and I can't imagine what the discussion looked like when implementing this decision. My (admittedly cynical) guess is that it was one part "We're fielding a lot of support questions on products that aren't ours and our malfunctioning" and two parts "Our customers will be more motivated to buy Philips Hue products…

I'll never understand why companies make such customer hostile decisions. I think it's because Apple more or less proved that the walled garden approach can be wildly successful and everyone is trying to copy them. Seems however that they are the only ones to have success with it.

They teach it now in business schools as case studies.

Re: Philips Hue blocks 3rd party lights

#83

Post by soperj » Mon, Dec 14, 2015, 10:07 PM UTC

balls187 wrote: post #75

soperj wrote: post #64

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And yet, lots of people don't avoid Apple.

> And yet, lots of people don't avoid Apple. On one hand, having to use Apple's proprietary Lightning connector sucks. On the other, having Apple be heavy handed with iOS App Store submissions means I have a higher confidence with my iOS Apps behaving compared to those I install on my Android Device.

The thing that deters me from ever writing something for iOS is that you have to own a Mac to do it.

Re: Philips Hue blocks 3rd party lights

#84

Post by bottled_poe » Mon, Dec 14, 2015, 10:08 PM UTC

I'm not convinced this was a hostile decision by Philips. It would be reasonable for the company to want to advance their own technology which would often entail a changing interface. If the third-party products are implementing an older interface, how is that the fault of Philips? The moral thing to do would be to standardise and publicise the interface...perhaps this is the situation already...?

Re: Philips Hue blocks 3rd party lights

#85

Post by kamaal » Mon, Dec 14, 2015, 10:08 PM UTC

wvenable wrote: post #27

gregmac wrote: post #22

This is the Philips controller software (app) that is refusing to talk to or control 3rd party light bulbs. I don't really see this as being a problem. It's not the nicest thing, perhaps, but neither is 3rd party companies building bulbs (presumably by ripping off the design and protocol of Philip's bulbs), and then relying on Philips to build the software so they can actually be used. In other words, Philips is refu…

The slippery slope of "intellectual property" is so steep that even building interface-compatible products is now considered ripping something off. We've come a long way from the age of IBM compatibles and the PC revolution.

Coming soon...

You won't be able to SSH into a server/box/machine, from a server/box/machine not built by the same manufacturer.

Re: Philips Hue blocks 3rd party lights

#86

Post by mbesto » Mon, Dec 14, 2015, 10:09 PM UTC

roymurdock wrote: post #74

mdip wrote: post #35

I'll never understand why companies make such customer hostile decisions. I can't see any upside to this and I can't imagine what the discussion looked like when implementing this decision. My (admittedly cynical) guess is that it was one part "We're fielding a lot of support questions on products that aren't ours and our malfunctioning" and two parts "Our customers will be more motivated to buy Philips Hue products…

Boss: We introduced Hue back in 2012 w/ a plan to lose money the first 3 years developing the hub, subsidizing partners, and getting our product out in the market. Tell me we're seeing a positive ROI now. Hue PM: Hue is profitable, but only marginally so. Our strategy of making up the initial investment on $60 per bulb hardware is being undermined by cheap 3rd party lighting fixtures. Plus we're incurring costs respo…

This is 100% spot on. I have been in meetings just like this in a past life.

Re: Philips Hue blocks 3rd party lights

#87

Post by TeMPOraL » Mon, Dec 14, 2015, 10:10 PM UTC

supercanuck wrote: post #82

AndrewKemendo wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'll never understand why companies make such customer hostile decisions. I think it's because Apple more or less proved that the walled garden approach can be wildly successful and everyone is trying to copy them. Seems however that they are the only ones to have success with it.

They teach it now in business schools as case studies.

This is probably the point where it all goes wrong. Like the game of deaf phone, by the time the idea reached the mind of students, it's twisted into an abomination, having lost the entire essence in-transit.

Re: Philips Hue blocks 3rd party lights

#88

Post by arnarbi » Mon, Dec 14, 2015, 10:10 PM UTC

rythie wrote: post #6

Surely with the Pi Zero selling at $5 there has got to be way to do this without Philip's locked in, expensive system?

That depends how this is enforced. If it is something like [1], you might need to device's public keys signed by Phillips.

[1] http://www.infineon.com/cms/en/product/security-ic/device-au...

Re: Philips Hue blocks 3rd party lights

#89

Post by steven2012 » Mon, Dec 14, 2015, 10:12 PM UTC

throwaway420 wrote: post #39

I was literally about to make a purchase but now I'll be considering other options. Good timing on your part hue. Do these idiot companies not learn anything from backlashes against Keurig and others?

I unfortunately just got my Hue Bridge 2.0... I guess I'll just return it back, but what a pain in the ass that is.

Re: Philips Hue blocks 3rd party lights

#90

Post by WorldMaker » Mon, Dec 14, 2015, 10:12 PM UTC

balls187 wrote: post #71

mdip wrote: post #35

I'll never understand why companies make such customer hostile decisions. I can't see any upside to this and I can't imagine what the discussion looked like when implementing this decision. My (admittedly cynical) guess is that it was one part "We're fielding a lot of support questions on products that aren't ours and our malfunctioning" and two parts "Our customers will be more motivated to buy Philips Hue products…

3rd argument: non certified bulbs may cause damage to the hue system, and be a hazzard risk. Curious what the process is to be listed as Friends of Hue (or w/e).

At the moment Phillips refers to traditional-style bulbs as Hue and less traditional lights such as the Bloom lamps and LED LightStrips as "Friends of Hue".

There certainly is an interesting question if they would start adding third party vendors to the "Friends of Hue" list, but right now its still a first-party designation for Phillips, so far as I've seen.