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Tesla shares dive after Consumer Reports yanks recommendation for Model S

latimes.com

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Re: Tesla shares dive after Consumer Reports yanks recommendation for Model S

#241

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I've never known a VW owner that has not had electrical problems within the first 5 years of ownership. Just my own data point.

neither BMW nor Mercs are in VW group (and god thanx for that!). Audi is, and generally, within those 3 brands, is considered as the cheapest, least luxurious, least fun alternative (R8 is an exception :))

To quote @GSElevator:

"Wearing a Rolex is like driving an Audi. It says you've got money, but nothing to say."

Re: Tesla shares dive after Consumer Reports yanks recommendation for Model S

#242

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My current car is 14 years old. My previous two reached 16 and 17 years. I try to run then as long as possible because cars are money sinks.

Well then this is obviously not an issue for you. You don't sound like the type to be an "early adopter" for cars, so I think it would be out of character for a consumer like yourself to buy a Tesla is the first place. I don't think they're alienating a significant portion of their demographic by not catering to people who only buy a car every one or two decades, especially considering they're selling a luxury sedan…

I would love to buy an electric car for my next vehicle. But if the operating cost, including repairs, is higher than a conventional car, then that's not a good deal for me. I'm certainly not going to pay a premium just for that.

I also don't like being stuck on the side of the road. Frequent powertrain repairs like I hear being reported on this page greatly concern me.

Re: Tesla shares dive after Consumer Reports yanks recommendation for Model S

#243

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Do you have an opinion on the Jaguar C-X75 concept? http://www.theengineer.co.uk/in-depth/analysis/jet-power-bla...

Wow, that looks really cool. Sadly it was going to be a million dollar car, and it was cancelled in 2012 after only 3 prototypes were built.

Well, yeah, traditionally the highest grade technology gets deployed in performance or luxury settings first, then makes its way down to mass production. IIRC that's what happened with airbag systems. So I don't see the genesis avenue as inherently limiting. MTT made the RetroRocket and it did the whole Hot Rod Power Tour without any significant issues, I think.

Re: Tesla shares dive after Consumer Reports yanks recommendation for Model S

#244
post #232

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I don't see the problem. Early adopters are shaking out the bugs in the Model S and the Model X. If Tesla adopts the Uber model, you're never going to care if the car has problems, it'll be Tesla's problems. All of this hand wringing assumes car ownership is going to continue as it has in the past. I'd say the tea leaves are showing something different with self driving cars advancing as quickly as they are. Tesla Mo…

If the car drives itself and you rent a trip rather than buy and own a specific vehicle, why would most people care to pay a premium for a Tesla trip rather than just getting a Nissan Leaf With Google or Hyundai e10 With Uber or a self-car2go or...?

My model assumes Tesla is the innovator, and has self-driving cars first (possibly in a partnership with Google). Uber is playing catchup, and incumbent auto manufacturers won't want to lose 90%+ of their demand to by-the-mile rentals.

Re: Tesla shares dive after Consumer Reports yanks recommendation for Model S

#245
post #232

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If the car drives itself and you rent a trip rather than buy and own a specific vehicle, why would most people care to pay a premium for a Tesla trip rather than just getting a Nissan Leaf With Google or Hyundai e10 With Uber or a self-car2go or...?

My model assumes Tesla is the innovator, and has self-driving cars first (possibly in a partnership with Google). Uber is playing catchup, and incumbent auto manufacturers won't want to lose 90%+ of their demand to by-the-mile rentals.

How much does being first matter here, though?

A self-driving taxi service is not easy to scale because in addition to good maps of anywhere you want to service, you need to own and maintain physical cars (starting with nightly cleaning on weekends). This isn't an app, and being popular in California won't help you operate vehicles in Barcelona.

On the other hand, once someone makes a good-enough software platform, they can just license it to any local Addison Lee-type taxi/minicab company that already owns the cars and has experience maintaining them. If that someone is Google, they might just give it away like the rest of their products.

Uber got relatively large adoption by largely avoiding trying to scale too much horizontally, by using local drivers with their own cars - routing is the only thing they've done (and it's not as good as local knowledge). They claim to not be a transportation company at all, they just connect contractors. That sort of thing won't be possible with self-driving Tesla taxis.

Plus, we don't yet know if Tesla is any good at making non-premium cars.

Regarding incumbents trying to avoid cannibalisation - are you familiar with carshare systems operated by BMW and Daimler?

Re: Tesla shares dive after Consumer Reports yanks recommendation for Model S

#246
post #67
post #52

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Your suggested configuration has very big downsides. Basically, your config would be an electric car which carries around a complete internal combustion engine, gas tank, and exhaust system just in case it runs out of battery. For simple commutes and around town, you'd be better off jettisoning the weight and cost and getting a slightly bigger battery. The hybrid car as originally conceived is genius: Small and effic…

That's why I mentioned a low HP engine, that would be just enough to maintain highway speed, to keep the weight small. Gas tank could be small, maybe 5 - 8 gallons.

Now your low HP engine is lugging around a giant empty battery. :-)

There may be trade offs to be had, but it seems to me that it's too easy to think "electric good" and not examine the tradeoffs carefully. I think that's why the original Prius did not have a plug-in option: it made no sense to people who analyzed the trade-offs. It was introduced simply because there was a market for "electric good".

I think the right trade-off is either all electric, or small-battery hybrid. It also might make sense to have a five-mile battery for people who make a lot of sub-five mile trips, but still regularly go further.

Re: Tesla shares dive after Consumer Reports yanks recommendation for Model S

#249

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Simply trading some luxuries for others. Owning a car is a luxury.

Only for people that live in high-population-density areas with meaningful public transit. Otherwise it's a practical necessity, unless having a job is a luxury as well.

You can move there.

Re: Tesla shares dive after Consumer Reports yanks recommendation for Model S

#250

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Not to ruin your day, but they're taking away your knobs, dials, and control of the vehicle.

This is actually ruining my day and night, idiotic move to impress... who actually? Soccer mums? Drivers need to focus on the road constantly, if i look away, there can be atomic blast right ahead of me and I will not notice it properly. Even a glance for 1-2s can have grave consequences in heavy traffic. Knobs are excellent thing. Touch screen is good only for passengers. In my knob-full car i can adjust most things…

I agree. But a big oled screen for a map, settings, and secondary systems can never be wrong can it.
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