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Don’t Feed the Beast – The Great Tech Recruiter Infestation

mocko.org.uk

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Re: Don’t Feed the Beast – The Great Tech Recruiter Infestation

#291

Post by logfromblammo »

gambiting wrote: post #241
logfromblammo wrote: post #222

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I certainly hope you meant to type £30k/year (~$45k/year). If you're only getting $30k (~£20k/year) as a software programmer of any kind, anywhere in the world, you should seriously consider finding a new employer, even if it requires emigrating. And remote jobs still exist. Canada has the 3rd largest video games industry in the world--after the US and Japan--and its growth has strained the available talent pool. So…

£20k/year is exactly what I'm on. My problem at the moment is that I've been working just a bit more than 2 years now, and I absolutely love what I'm doing. I'm part of the engine team on a game that will be one of the biggest releases of 2016, and learning a tonne every day. I got very flexible hours, private health insurance and 30 days of paid vacation days a year. It's just the pay that's abysmal. I've got two co…

So... Pitbull Studio (Epic UK) for something using Unreal Engine 4?

We don't have an international union, so I don't exactly have any leverage here, but I want you to be paid more. Do you seriously think that you are so far below the median level of skill for a C++ programmer with a degree and two years of experience, that you should be paid so little?

Go. Look for another job, and find out just what they would be willing to pay you. With an offer in hand that you could accept on its own merits, go to your current employer and, without mentioning anything about your other offer, ask that your pay rate be reevaluated, to match your skills in the current market. If you don't get a significant payrise, then at that point, you can decide whether it is worth more to have extra cash in your hand, or to keep a job that you know you like, but pays peanuts--stale peanuts at that. Remember, you don't have to accept any offer you don't like.

For now, you seem to have decided that you like your current job £15-20k/year more than anything else you think you could possibly get.

Re: Don’t Feed the Beast – The Great Tech Recruiter Infestation

#292

Post by dang »

ryguytilidie wrote: post #248
rnovak wrote: post #239

Earlier quoted context omitted.

there are literally millions of recruiters in the world. You think knowing a couple hundred means you know how they all act, or even a majority?

So let me see if I follow. It is completely rational and even considered informational to post some strawmen about 2 or 3 recruiters. HOWEVER, knowing hundreds of recruiters and talking about their actual behavior is not rational. "You think knowing a couple hundred means you know how they all act, or even a majority?" I...what? Are we just coming up with the dumbest, most obtuse questions possible? Again, what shred…

Please stop.

Re: Don’t Feed the Beast – The Great Tech Recruiter Infestation

#293

Post by SideburnsOfDoom »

ryguytilidie wrote: post #250
teh_klev wrote: post #244

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think you've completely missed the humour in this post. It describes in a funny, sarcastic and sardonic article just about every experience I and my dev/IT pals have had with IT recruitment agencies. It's not about in-house recruiters like you have at FB/Google, it's about the scumbags that hold potential employees to ransom and act as self appointed gatekeepers to jobs that might or might not exist. As an experime…

"It's Friday, go have a beer, relax and rediscover your sense of humour." Oh good, the "you didn't think this was funny therefore your sense of humor sucks" logic. I guess its much more "fun and interesting" to work yourself into a rage over things you made up versus just not thinking those things are funny...?

> Oh good, the "you didn't think this was funny therefore your sense of humor sucks" logic.

That's taking it quite personally. We can agree that Mocko's sardonic style isn't everyone's cup of tea. If you don't like it, accept that others do and that he's really not going to change it for you. He makes it abundantly clear that he is in a position to ignore (at best) or belittle (at worst) people who disagree with him. So move on.

Re: Don’t Feed the Beast – The Great Tech Recruiter Infestation

#295

Post by anotherevan »

crucialfelix wrote: post #135
mattzito wrote: post #5

At least in the US, the whole recruiting industry hit its nadir during the dot-com bubble of 2000. I remember getting a cold-call from a recruiter, "Hey, got a great gig at a soon-to-IPO startup for a Solaris and Linux guru", "No thanks", hang up, the phone next to me rings, same dude, literally just dialing up the extension tree. My boss at the time had a strategy where whenever a recruiter called offering "top notc…

In NY during that time period one company got a cold call from a head hunter asking to speak to "Mitch" or some name like that. That was the dog's name. They had gotten some list of names and it included the office dog.

Oh, I so want to make a LinkedIn profile for my cat now!

Major duties: Licking the spot where my balls use to be.

Re: Don’t Feed the Beast – The Great Tech Recruiter Infestation

#296

Post by vorg »

andrelaszlo wrote: post #151
michaelt wrote: post #119

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They are rent-seekers, pure and simple, and they leech off our industry. I'm no fan of recruiters, but nothing stops you applying to the company directly, and nothing stops the company posting their own job ads.

Actually your CV can be hijacked by a recruiter, effectively keeping you out of a job. Imagine this scenario: You get a call from a recruiter. They seem to have an interesting position/client/network so you send over your CV. A couple of months later you are actively looking for a job, so you make a list of cool startups in your area and send your CV and a customized cover letter. They all answer that they got your C…

> They all answer that they got your CV from the recruiter

I've never known recruiter scum to send out a CV without my name, contact details, and references stripped out.

Re: Don’t Feed the Beast – The Great Tech Recruiter Infestation

#297

Post by vorg »

These types of people don't just get themselves into recruiter roles lying about vacancies and candidates to swindle clients and skim the takings, but also into roles managing open source projects lying about download numbers and faking popularity rankings, to flip companies and sell consulting services and conference seats.

Re: Don’t Feed the Beast – The Great Tech Recruiter Infestation

#298

Post by ryguytilidie »

rnovak wrote: post #253
ryguytilidie wrote: post #248

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So let me see if I follow. It is completely rational and even considered informational to post some strawmen about 2 or 3 recruiters. HOWEVER, knowing hundreds of recruiters and talking about their actual behavior is not rational. "You think knowing a couple hundred means you know how they all act, or even a majority?" I...what? Are we just coming up with the dumbest, most obtuse questions possible? Again, what shred…

Your statements literally say that. "I know hundreds of recruiters". That's literally what YOU SAID. That's not dumb, or obtuse. You also imply that just because none of those people act like that, that the ENTIRE industry must be the same. It's getting really difficult to not be offended at some of what you're saying. I'm WASPY as they come and your arguments are so privileged it's not even funny.

"You also imply that just because none of those people act like that, that the ENTIRE industry must be the same."

I never said anything remotely close to the thing you are saying above. Even if I did, the OP said the opposite thing based on a much smaller sample size and of course none of you have any issue with that....? I said that I know hundreds of recruiters and they don't act like this. In contrast, the OP said that he knows a couple recruiters and they do act like this. How on earth could you possibly go with the "yeah, that OP guy is spot on! But man, this other guy who knows way more recruiters and is making the opposite generalization that doesn't make it as easy for us to get mad at faceless strangers is full of shit!" line of logic...?

"I'm WASPY as they come and your arguments are so privileged it's not even funny."

Huh? What are you referring to? Again, the OP wrote a long rant about how all recruiters should be avoided because a few are bad. I then said I know a lot and that I've had the opposite experience. So, you actually believe that ripping a bunch of faceless strangers is NOT privileged but simply defending them is...? What. The. Fuck?

Re: Don’t Feed the Beast – The Great Tech Recruiter Infestation

#299

Post by ryguytilidie »

rnovak wrote: post #239
ryguytilidie wrote: post #142

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"You do realize that there is an entire IT Industry outside of Facebook and Google?" Was there a single fiber in your being that believed I did not...? I cannot imagine a human brain believing this is a useful post for even a single second. Yet, here you are defending it... "You are using your experience at two of of the best technology companies in the world to trash the author's criticism of the recruiting in the "…

there are literally millions of recruiters in the world. You think knowing a couple hundred means you know how they all act, or even a majority?

Curious why you didn't make this response to the OP? All you would have to do is change "a couple hundred" to "a couple"?

Re: Don’t Feed the Beast – The Great Tech Recruiter Infestation

#300

Post by ryguytilidie »

SideburnsOfDoom wrote: post #293
ryguytilidie wrote: post #250

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"It's Friday, go have a beer, relax and rediscover your sense of humour." Oh good, the "you didn't think this was funny therefore your sense of humor sucks" logic. I guess its much more "fun and interesting" to work yourself into a rage over things you made up versus just not thinking those things are funny...?

> Oh good, the "you didn't think this was funny therefore your sense of humor sucks" logic. That's taking it quite personally. We can agree that Mocko's sardonic style isn't everyone's cup of tea. If you don't like it, accept that others do and that he's really not going to change it for you. He makes it abundantly clear that he is in a position to ignore (at best) or belittle (at worst) people who disagree with him.…

"rediscover your sense of humour"

"Oh good, the "you didn't think this was funny therefore your sense of humor sucks" logic."

"That's taking it quite personally."

What do you even say to someone in this situation...?

But, just as the OP is entitled to an opinion, I'm entitled to say that his opinion is a bunch of horseshit. Sorry that this is so offensive to you?

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