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Don’t Feed the Beast – The Great Tech Recruiter Infestation

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Re: Don’t Feed the Beast – The Great Tech Recruiter Infestation

#141

Post by onion2k »

I'm not suggesting the author is necessarily wrong, but I've been in the IT industry long enough to notice that there are more "Recruiters are terrible people!" articles whenever there's a boom in tech jobs and people can find their own role. As soon as the market contracts and jobs become hard to find, all the articles stop.

I think people's view of tech recruiters is a function of the market rather than a de facto truth - recruiters are perceived as bad as the market gets better because people don't need them in order to find a new job. That doesn't automatically mean recruiters are bad. Come the next downturn they'll be useful again. We just need to recognise that.

Re: Don’t Feed the Beast – The Great Tech Recruiter Infestation

#142

Post by ryguytilidie »

supercanuck wrote: post #114
ryguytilidie wrote: post #90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Snark for no reason? Check. Somehow extrapolates me saying that I know lots of recruiters because I worked with recruiters at a large company means that I believe IT only exists within two companies on earth? Check. Thanks, great response.

You are using your experience at two of of the best technology companies in the world to trash the author's criticism of the recruiting in the "IT" industry. Your comment was very tone deaf.

"You do realize that there is an entire IT Industry outside of Facebook and Google?"

Was there a single fiber in your being that believed I did not...? I cannot imagine a human brain believing this is a useful post for even a single second. Yet, here you are defending it...

"You are using your experience at two of of the best technology companies in the world to trash the author's criticism of the recruiting in the "IT" industry."

No. I'm really not. I am a recruiter. While at Google and Facebook I met hundreds of recruiters. Since there is a world outside of these two companies (Wow! I did know that! Who knew??) almost all of us now work at other companies. At these companies, none of them behave the way the author describes.

So you managed to read my post, respond with completely embarassing, useless snark because, like the author, you didn't bother to understand what you were talking about and instead just said "I have projected some extra idiotic/mean spirited behavior on this complete stranger and now I will get mad/snarky about it". If you're going to communicate with others you need to have it either be useful or pleasant. Unfortunately you seem to have fell short of both...

Re: Don’t Feed the Beast – The Great Tech Recruiter Infestation

#144

Post by nordic_nomad »

mizchief2 wrote: post #44

As a manager I've had a recruiter basically say "That's a nice development department you have there, shame if something were to happen to it." As he described that by signing a contract with him and keeping "active" by hiring his candidates a couple of times a year, he would not solicit the developers at my company.

Thoughtful of him.

Re: Don’t Feed the Beast – The Great Tech Recruiter Infestation

#146

Post by celticninja »

mizchief2 wrote: post #44

As a manager I've had a recruiter basically say "That's a nice development department you have there, shame if something were to happen to it." As he described that by signing a contract with him and keeping "active" by hiring his candidates a couple of times a year, he would not solicit the developers at my company.

I have seen that done, basically a company I worked for had a contractual agreement to use a certain agency for their contractors. The agency finds out contractors are being hired and they are not being offered the opportunity to out forward candidates. The recruiter came to a meeting with my manager and was very cordial and asked why they were not being used, the manager said he didnt like them (or something similar, basically making it a personal issue with them). The recruiter simply said they had a contractual agreement and whilst they probably would not pursue it legally they would quite happily use his company as a resource to select contractors from.

After 2 staff members were offered new positions the manager decided he didnt hate the agency that much. Whilst I liked the manager it was refreshing to see someone combat this situation whilst expressing clearly they would not pursue it legally.

Re: Don’t Feed the Beast – The Great Tech Recruiter Infestation

#147

Post by SandB0x »

JPKab wrote: post #97
ryguytilidie wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Honestly it seems like the author has some serious problems. I know hundreds of recruiters having been at Google and Facebook and not a single one of them thinks like this at all. To say "now grovel and be exploited" about a process where the person will almost certainly end up with a fantastic offer for an engineering job in a comfortable office with great pay and great working conditions may actually be the least s…

He's obviously very hyperbolic, but when you leave the sphere of elite IT (Google/Facebook) and head into the folks who are in other geographic locations (and not willing to move to tech hotspots) suddenly the skills in demand and the positions available become overwhelmingly large enterprise type IT jobs. The recruiters who are working for these companies are, to some extent, as the author describes. The real reason…

> The real reason the industry is so slimy on that end is because enterprise companies are too old fashioned to view technology workers as people who deserve to be paid salaries on par or exceeding middle managers. Therefore, the salaries simply aren't high enough to attract talent beyond H1B indentures and fakers who are horribly unproductive. This creates an IT department that isn't very good or effective, and thus isn't thought of as deserving high pay.

Absolutely true.

Simplifying a little, there are companies here that everybody wants to leave and companies that everybody wants to join. It's difficult to leave the first category since the employee's skills have atrophied (see https://blog.stackoverflow.com/2015/09/how-to-be-awesome/).

Re: Don’t Feed the Beast – The Great Tech Recruiter Infestation

#148

Post by ryguytilidie »

praptak wrote: post #49
mbroshi wrote: post #34

I will admit I did not make it through this entire article, but it really did not ring true to me at all--just sounded like an unsupported, hostile, angry rant. >> “Fucked if we care” think the recruiters, “now grovel and be exploited”. ... >> You’re meat to them, a resource to be packaged and sold and exploited. Who's being exploited here? I think he's implying the programmers, but as someone who left academia for i…

> If a comment as irate, mean-spirited, and unsubstantiated as this blog post appeared in HN, it would get down-voted into oblivion. Yet this article instead of getting flagged into oblivion got upvoted to #1 as of now. Could that be that HN readers' experience with recruiters mirrors the author's experience?

I think the complaint is that the author could have instead made this argument in a rational, not irate, not mean spirited and substantiated way. What would have been so bad about that?

Re: Don’t Feed the Beast – The Great Tech Recruiter Infestation

#149

Post by xixixao »

ryguytilidie wrote: post #70
mbroshi wrote: post #34

I will admit I did not make it through this entire article, but it really did not ring true to me at all--just sounded like an unsupported, hostile, angry rant. >> “Fucked if we care” think the recruiters, “now grovel and be exploited”. ... >> You’re meat to them, a resource to be packaged and sold and exploited. Who's being exploited here? I think he's implying the programmers, but as someone who left academia for i…

Honestly it seems like the author has some serious problems. I know hundreds of recruiters having been at Google and Facebook and not a single one of them thinks like this at all. To say "now grovel and be exploited" about a process where the person will almost certainly end up with a fantastic offer for an engineering job in a comfortable office with great pay and great working conditions may actually be the least s…

Since it wasn't stressed yet to you: The article talks about recruiters from outside of tech companies, not recruiters at FB or Google. I have to say I'm doubtful you "know" hundreds of recruiters (inside or outside the companies), unless you mean you got an email from hundreds of recruiters. If you just reject the emails, you probably won't get the experience described in the article.

Re: Don’t Feed the Beast – The Great Tech Recruiter Infestation

#150

Post by ryanSrich »

nordic_nomad wrote: post #112
joeyspn wrote: post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You clearly don't have a clue about how things are here in the EU. Few weeks ago one of these charitable souls deceived a co-worker offering him an incredible opportunity to move to London and the result was: - £15k ($23k) less salary than advertised in the offer - No benefits (healthcare, dental, etc) - No free food/snacks/bevare at the company - No perks (equipment, etc) When questioned about this, the recruiter sa…

Holy god, that's a job in technology? Sounds like your typical retail wage slave situation here in the US. Even entry level tech jobs are in the $40-$50k range generally.

Even for entry level that seems way low. Unless of course you're referring to typical IT support and tech role, not SE.
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