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Apple Unveils the iPad Pro

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Re: Apple Unveils the iPad Pro

#641

Post by Fiahil »

bjacobel wrote: post #440
austenallred wrote: post #278

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I really don't give a shit who is copying who. It's technology; we're all building on the backs of inventions created by other people. The important thing to me is who does it the best, not who does it first. The iPod was nowhere near the first mp3 player, it was just the best one. The iPad wasn't close to the first tablet. Will it be the best tablet? I don't know, but whether or not the Surface had a keyboard first…

The really galling part is the total refusal to admit they're not doing anything innovative. "There has never been another product like the iPad Pro before" was a real quote from today's presentation, and is a complete falsehood.

I prefer to think of this as mermaid marketing. It's nice to hear them sing, but don't fall for it or they will eat you.

Watching theses events is like this famous passage of the Odyssey. Once you are tightly attached, and don't risk to go overboard (and start buying stuff you don't really need), then enjoy the show. I've been told their exciting song is the most detailed and beautiful thing you've ever heard :)

Re: Apple Unveils the iPad Pro

#642

Post by ux-app »

rdancer wrote: post #574
IkmoIkmo wrote: post #474

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not a complete falsehood but it's a totally empty statement. Virtually any device you put out that's not exactly, spec-by-spec the same, you can say 'never been a product like this before'. It's true and empty. They do a lot of those, they're true, hyperbolic, and totally devoid of any significance. For example they'll say 'the iPhone 6 was the most popular iPhone ... EVER'. As if it's significant. But that's co…

Their ability to churn out better and better devices, year after year, is what's remarkable. That we come to expect it, and don't consider it news, is a testament to their achievement. This is not normal; the industry -- both hardware & software -- is plagued with regressions, with many older models or releases that are preferred by the users to newer ones. Apple are truly unique in their ability to deliver improveme…

> Apple are truly unique in their ability to deliver improvements, introduce new technologies, and implement existing technologies in ways that are actually usable, while keeping regressions and serious problems low, much lower than the competition.

I like Apple products as much as the next guy, but cmon, this is some serious kool-aid drinking here.

Apple doesn't produce software that is any less issue prone than any other vendor. In fact the chorus complaining about software regressions has been getting louder and louder, even from Apple fans.

Yosemite was a particularly low point with regard to Apple software.

http://fieldguide.gizmodo.com/the-worst-bugs-in-os-x-yosemit...

http://www.tekrevue.com/yosemite-bugs-time-for-another-snow-...

Software is hard. Apple aren't special, their software has just as many issues as any other vendor's, which is actually kind of disappointing given they have full control of the hardware, MS actually does a lot better with regard to software quality given the varied HW landscape Windows is deployed to.

Edit: Software quality isn't just a Yosemite issue with Apple, it's a long running joke that you should never install a X.0 OSX release due to bugs.

Re: Apple Unveils the iPad Pro

#643

Post by etchalon »

bduerst wrote: post #584
thrownaway2424 wrote: post #575

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They were _possible_ in 2012 but getting everyone on board is difficult. Google included NFC on the Nexus S in 2010. The Nexus S was an atrocious piece of junk compared to its contemporary, the iPhone 4. NFC did nothing to make using the Nexus S more pleasurable. Android beam? Nobody used that. Google did not release the NFC-capable Wallet app until 2011, and at that time the integration between the app, the phone (s…

What you just described is exactly how Apple killed NFC adoption. The lack of NFC, or even announcing plans for NFC, from Apple made it very difficult to develop anything useful for NFC. Without universal market share and with an uncertain future, NFC was avoided by many hardware developers who would have built anything useful. June 2012 was the hinging point because it was when NFC payments were just picking up stea…

What are you talking about? Passbook was never a payment system, it just had gift cards. Passbook isn't a payment system NOW. Apple Pay is, Passbook is just the app that shows users their credit cards.

Re: Apple Unveils the iPad Pro

#644

Post by acqq »

m_mueller wrote: post #627
[deleted] wrote: post #623

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[deleted]

iPad has always had 4:3. And it's still quite a difference between the two, 3:2 still feels very strange when you hold it in portrait. Holding A4 paper in portrait makes this even more obvious.

You are right, iPads had always 4:3, mea culpa.

"The aspect ratio of A4, 1:1.414 is near the average of 1.5 for 2:3 and 1.333 for 3:4. US Letter is 1.294.

Still Surface Pro 3 aspect is better than 16:9 (1.78) at least.

Re: Apple Unveils the iPad Pro

#645

Post by npunt »

kailuowang wrote: post #377
austenallred wrote: post #278

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I really don't give a shit who is copying who. It's technology; we're all building on the backs of inventions created by other people. The important thing to me is who does it the best, not who does it first. The iPod was nowhere near the first mp3 player, it was just the best one. The iPad wasn't close to the first tablet. Will it be the best tablet? I don't know, but whether or not the Surface had a keyboard first…

It's not the copying that worries people, it's the lack of not-coping, i.e. innovations. iPod is not the first mp3 player, iPhone is not the first smart phone, but they were packed with innovative ideas that stood them out. We see less and less such ideas from Apple. Their execution/quality control is still top notch though, but other companies are catching up.

> We see less and less such ideas from Apple.

Disagree. This is a really commonly held viewpoint that I think is the product of our fast news cycles, and I don't think it approaches truth for another several years.

You are totally right that iPod and iPhone were not the first. While these were cool products when they came out, I think what's often lost is that it was only in the years of incremental improvements that defined how important these products were.

Tons of use cases are being unlocked in health, education, home automation, transportation, payments, enterprise, etc that these markets have been waiting for and wanting and are truly transformative. They're just not talked about as much, or hit that level of 'omg' for people who aren't dealing with those use cases, but they're real. The less sexy incremental stuff is amazing, and in fact, way more interesting because so few companies get the details right.

Just like you're saying about not being first, most blow-your-mind ideas that will come out in the next 10 years are probably already thought of, prototyped, or launched in some highly crippled form to an extremely limited audience. Two amazing things we can assume are in the pipeline are:

1. Driverless car, which will fundamentally change our transportation infrastructure.

2. Eye tracking and face tracking, which unlock new interaction paradigms that are even more natural and seamless. See the recent Faceshift acquisition [1] for evidence.

These are going to be awesome! But they'll take time to perfect.

I'm not sure what qualifies as innovations for you. I'll admit I'm not blown away by today's stuff, it is S-cycle after all, but I am impressed by the way they've implemented 3D touch. Its the first force touch implementation (vs watch and macbook) that I really like because it looks incredibly intuitive and everyday useful - like something that I'll wonder how I lived without.

Well anyway, I think we'd probably agree about a lot things, but I'd be curious as to what big innovation you've got in mind that's missing. Cheers.

[1] http://www.macrumors.com/2015/09/04/faceshift-motion-capture...

Re: Apple Unveils the iPad Pro

#646

Post by randyrand »

josephpmay wrote: post #485
elemenopy wrote: post #381

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Also, how come on the slide they are selling iPad Mini 2 & 4 but not iPad Mini 3? This is so confusing

The iPad Mini 3 is just an iPad Mini 2 with touchID. They probably figured touchID should remain a differentiating feature to upcharge for.

They should have just called it ipad Mini 2 with TouchID. It didn't even improve on the CPU. bah-humbug!

Re: Apple Unveils the iPad Pro

#647

Post by com2kid »

kailuowang wrote: post #377
austenallred wrote: post #278

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I really don't give a shit who is copying who. It's technology; we're all building on the backs of inventions created by other people. The important thing to me is who does it the best, not who does it first. The iPod was nowhere near the first mp3 player, it was just the best one. The iPad wasn't close to the first tablet. Will it be the best tablet? I don't know, but whether or not the Surface had a keyboard first…

It's not the copying that worries people, it's the lack of not-coping, i.e. innovations. iPod is not the first mp3 player, iPhone is not the first smart phone, but they were packed with innovative ideas that stood them out. We see less and less such ideas from Apple. Their execution/quality control is still top notch though, but other companies are catching up.

The main innovations that the iPod and iPhone launched with was in regards to their business models.

iPod had iTunes, true flat rate pricing for all music. Giant articles (if not books) have been written describing the huge challenge that was.

The iPhone was a completely new relationship between the phone manufacturer and the cellular carrier that allowed Apple to rake in unheard of profits. Their other main innovation with the iPhone was making a touch screen UI that was good. To be fair, that took a lot of engineering and UX work (early gen cap touch was terrible).

Apple was then able to pivot and make an app store built on existing infrastructure, another innovation that none of the other phone manufactures made. Yes "app stores" existed before the App Store, but they where not the one stop shop with guaranteed assurances that Apple offered. Executing on the App Store idea perfectly involved innovation for sure.

Re: Apple Unveils the iPad Pro

#648

Post by randyrand »

jameshart wrote: post #257

I found it interesting that there was no mention of handwriting recognition for the pencil input - just not on the radar, it seems. Probably for the best, it's always been a disappointment on every device it's been used on. Official support for an external keyboard for iPad is interesting - among the 'professional' kinds of applications that might now become possible to use on a device like this are development tools…

I agree. Interesting. Typing became faster than writing is what caused it IMO.

Re: Apple Unveils the iPad Pro

#649

Post by jamra »

dmoy wrote: post #613
jamra wrote: post #512

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Apple strives with the nuances of its hardware. It's not necessarily how innovative and unique the product is, but the strength at which Apple secures the most unique hardware that sets them apart from the competition. Their touch sensors are different than everyone else's in supporting multi strength touches. They have good battery life with larger than HD displays. The device weights 1.5 lbs, which is much lighter…

It is about 14% lighter.

According to google, the Surface 2 is ~1.5 lbs. It's lighter than I remembered it being.

Re: Apple Unveils the iPad Pro

#650

Post by ronyeh »

randyrand wrote: post #638
seanmcdirmid wrote: post #559

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The starbucks full of students typing out reports on iPads with bluetooth keyboards begs to differ. I mean, obviousy, you can't do all work on an iPad, but for a certain class of "work" it works fine.

The most annoying bit related to getting real work done on iOS is how long it takes to switch apps. Switching from one app to the other should be 1 click if you want to get serious work done. This is how windows and the surface work. 1 click. A taskbar at the bottom. It works. The current iOS takes 2 clicks, a swipe, and a tap. Unacceptable for multiasking. Now that iIOS has multitasking it changes in an important wa…

It's a bit of a hidden feature, but for 4 years, iOS has had multitasking gestures.

http://www.macworld.com/article/1163019/ios_5_new_gestures.h...

If you swipe with four fingers to the left or right, you can move between your two most recent apps. Hopefully iOS9 will make "multi-tasking" even easier.

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