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EU tells Apple to open everything up to its rivals

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Re: EU tells Apple to open everything up to its rivals

#981

Post by Apocryphon »

LexGray wrote: post #941
ragestorm wrote: post #911

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would equate it to a rabid badger that is behind a door behind another door with both having signs saying ‘beware of rabid badger’. If you want to play with the badger, go for it or just leave the doors shut and you never have to worry about it.

Yes, but in a world where people have been trained to ignore signs if they want to have nice things. No kid and most adults would think twice before clicking I agree even if the screen was flashing red and the phone was making klaxon sounds.

If there's any company in the world that can use UX to their advantage, it's Apple. If they can create text message social division simply through blue vs. green bubble, they can find a way to subtly make non-App Store apps unpalatable except to technical users who know what they're doing.

Re: EU tells Apple to open everything up to its rivals

#982

Post by Aerbil313 »

organsnyder wrote: post #70

I was at [IAPP Global Privacy Summit]( https://iapp.org/conference/global-privacy-summit/ ) 2022, where Tim Cook gave a keynote. He started with highlighting all of the ways Apple protects its users privacy (many of which are great, and the reason I use Apple products!), but then he pivoted to make the case that Apple being forced to allow rival app stores would compromise their ability to protect users' privacy. Thi…

Because grandmas and scammers.

It took me a long time to realize that Apple is doing the right thing here.

Outside of our little bubble, smartphones are a means to an end. No one bothers to learn technology more than what they can get by in their everyday life. Technology needs to be as simple and intuitive as possible.

Now, if Apple were to let a person enter developer mode by solving some Leetcode puzzles or CS quizzes, I'd be all in for it. Though I can still see scammers scamming people even with this.

Re: EU tells Apple to open everything up to its rivals

#983

Post by Aerbil313 »

johnzim wrote: post #61
olliej wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Indeed, it will be so great when web developers can just force everyone to use chrome.

The inexplicable need to make the browser a second OS with worse everything boggles my mind. Especially on mobile devices which prize battery life. It won't give users choice because we as an industry have again and again just chosen what's easiest for us instead of best for the customer. We'd 100% still be using Flash if Apple hadn't refused to support it because of the battery and performance issues. This forum spe…

There is a need for instant-install software and instant-access data. That is web. The web will be a second OS, because it needs to be, and well, it already is. Worse-everything won't be anymore as the web fully matures.

Re: EU tells Apple to open everything up to its rivals

#984

Post by tenebrisalietum »

Apocryphon wrote: post #240
tenebrisalietum wrote: post #173

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Privacy and security are OS functions Naive take. Network sockets, remote servers, and data brokers don't care about local file permissions and an OS won't be able to tell me if corp-surveillance.justbuyme.com might be a domain hosting a privacy-disrespecting service without some sort of human-mediated reputation service.

Then we can look forward to an exciting front in the arms race that is computer security. Surely Apple, for all of their engineering and design brilliance, are up to the challenge?

It's not too exciting. That front is capability-based operating systems (someday) and application whitelisting (a.k.a. an app store).

Re: EU tells Apple to open everything up to its rivals

#985

Post by pornel »

s3p wrote: post #975
pornel wrote: post #971

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not just the price that's outrageous, but also anti-competitive terms that come with it. You're not allowed to have a better price outside of the App Store. iOS users aren't paying for their preferred payment system, it's everyone else subsidizing Apple's cut. You're not allowed to give customers a choice of payment methods (people like Apple's subscription, but some may prefer PayPal, especially for multi-platf…

This is not true. Youtube Premium, for instance, is more expensive if you subscribe on iOS versus web.

Add to the list the fact that the rules are not applied equally. Big companies can get special deals when Apple feels like it. Small devs can get randomly screwed when their reviewer misunderstands a rule.

Re: EU tells Apple to open everything up to its rivals

#986

Post by _aavaa_ »

theshrike79 wrote: post #791
Apocryphon wrote: post #176

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If the sandbox can be imposed on an OS level then apps on alternative stores will have to conform to the same baseline of security restrictions.

The issue is that "imposing the sandbox" isn't simple. Apple themselves have "imposed a sandbox" for Safari since the first version appeared on iOS. Still we had multiple exploits, even though they owned both sides of the code. Now imagine a situation where you're building a sandbox and the sandboxed application is using every trick possible to try to get out.

> Now imagine a situation where you're building a sandbox and the sandboxed application is using every trick possible to try to get out.

This hellish hypothetical you pose already exists. It’s called macOS.

Re: EU tells Apple to open everything up to its rivals

#987

Post by _aavaa_ »

theshrike79 wrote: post #120
Andrew_nenakhov wrote: post #109

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you like Apple's policies, just don't sideload and install everything from their official AppStore. Nothing will change for you then. You can do it on MacBooks as well.

When this goes through, you can be 100% sure there will be a Meta-only iOS store along with a Google iOS store and all their apps will move there. After that if you want to use apps to access any Google or Meta service, you'll need to get it from their store - that doesn't have any pesky limitations on user profiling or stupid guidelines for privacy.

This is a pretty defeatist take. Those big bad mega corporations will siphon all our privacy and our only solution is to allow Apple its monopoly.

Apple’s approach to hindering facebook’s spying is a technical one. But it’s not the only one. Just as we can take a political approach to dealing with Apple, so too with Facebook.

Workplace safety regulations didn’t exist until they did. Same with pollution. So too with meaningful privacy laws; and not cost of doing business fines, but the kind of fines that define business practices.

Re: EU tells Apple to open everything up to its rivals

#988

Post by ranguna »

laserlight wrote: post #824
ranguna wrote: post #638

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yep, just like they do on android. Oh... Wait a second, they don't do that.

> Wait a second, they don't do that. Do they need to do that, in the first place? And, is there a guarantee that they won't?

All I know is that they didn't do it.

Re: EU tells Apple to open everything up to its rivals

#989

Post by Moldoteck »

throwaway45680 wrote: post #819
MaKey wrote: post #803

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Given that this scenario hasn't happened with Android, which allows sideloading, this argument seems like baseless fearmongering to me.

Play store allows basically anything (including obviously fake/scam/adware/spyware apps), there's nothing to be gained by doing this on Android, you'd lose an easy distribution mechanism that doesn't limit you, helps you gain victims and provides credibility - it's on top of Google then it must be good, right? Also consider the market share of iOS and Android. Why bother for such small amount of price sensitive users…

so you say there are no scam apps on appstore? Asking bc I've read a lot of articles abt scammy aps there and apple is doing nothing to kill these
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