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Negotiations Failed: How Oracle Killed Java EE

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Re: Negotiations Failed: How Oracle Killed Java EE

#91

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Since when OpenJDK is preinstalled on Windows?

... and iOS? And I’ve only done upgrades, but I don’t believe any JVM is preinstalled on MacOS.

Apple used to have its own JVM implementation.

As for iOS, RoboVM, Codename ONE, GluonVM are three possible AOT compilers to native code.

Re: Negotiations Failed: How Oracle Killed Java EE

#92

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Nice joke (apparently bad taste for the HN crowd). That said is C# really great ? come on .. they have F#, and F > C. QED

Honestly I'm not joking, but I am a casual coder. I have only learnt what I need to do, to do certain things. Which compared to most here isn't that much. (See my other responses, I'd actually love some input there, just wish I had more time to learn) Edit: as to the reference to the last part of your comment, I have only been using what I knew to do the job I needed, I'm not a full time coder so I can't search the l…

What do you mean ? you only learned C# so you could work and have no time to learn things like F# ?

Re: Negotiations Failed: How Oracle Killed Java EE

#93
post #23

The Java ecosystem has been slowly dying for years, it's already the new Cobol at this stage. I have the impression that a lot of the mindshare has switched to the Node and Javascript ecosystem, especially the frontend devs, via the Typescript / Angular path, which is a natural path to Java developers due to the comfort given by familiar concepts like static types, classes, etc. When I used to do Java, I always found…

I would not go as far to say it's dying but it's heavily slowing down for sure. First because of the big move out of the "entreprise" software and secondly because of Oracle legal team. It's definitely due to the licensing that Android is switching to Kotlin for example.

PagerDuty, Zoom, Slack —- seems like a great time for enterprise software.

Re: Negotiations Failed: How Oracle Killed Java EE

#94

I propose to mimic the intended move of the Indonesian government to move the capitol from Java to Borneo by forking OpenJDK/Java to OpenBDK/Borneo. If Oracle wants to keep the Java(tm) trademark, they can keep it.

Are you going to replace the 99% OpenJDK developers that are on Oracle's paycheck as well?

Re: Negotiations Failed: How Oracle Killed Java EE

#95
post #18
post #13

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Before the language becomes a performance bottleneck there is so much stuff to consider that it quickly becomes clear how the choice of language doesn't really make a difference, except in special cases such as embedded systems.

A language that requires C for anything regarding performance is only useful for scripting and learning to program.

... and serving Instagram to the world...

Re: Negotiations Failed: How Oracle Killed Java EE

#96

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Strange attitude to take when you can just target OpenJDK and then it is completely irrelevant what Oracle does or does not do. The fact is that every single one of the largest companies has some Java or Scala code within their core platform. And none of them have ever raised Oracle as a risk.

The most valuable corporation in the world as of this date uses zero Java for anything “core”. Anecdotally, nearly every CIO/CTO I’ve encountered in the last few sees Oracle as a huge risk. Most particularly with regards to databases, which are even sticker than applications which have shorter life cycles.

You mean the servers Apple has running on WebObjects, JEE and Clojure for iTunes, Apple Maps and their iCloud?

Re: Negotiations Failed: How Oracle Killed Java EE

#97
post #18

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A language that requires C for anything regarding performance is only useful for scripting and learning to program.

... and serving Instagram to the world...

I seriously doubt it is pure Python.

Re: Negotiations Failed: How Oracle Killed Java EE

#98
post #69
post #60

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Kotlin is a JVM language, sold as a better Java, and the JVM is really the thing that is the echo system gathers around, not necessarily the language Java. Other interesting languages you have on the JVM is Scala (multi-paradigm), Clojure (Lisp), EtaLang (Haskell) - https://eta-lang.org - https://www.scala-lang.org - https://kotlinlang.org - https://clojure.org

Notice how I separately addressed JVM and Java. Java is already losing market share to JVM competitor languages. JVM is in a stronger position than Java, but imagine a world were 15-10 years ago native compilation for JVM bytecode became available instead of 1 year ago. LLVM wouldn't have stood a chance. Kotlin and Scala (I'm not too familiar with Clojure and others) are hedging their bets and making JS/Webassembly a…

I know for a fact that in the case of Clojure (and I assume the reasoning is similar for Kotlin and Scala) that targeting other ecosystems has nothing to do with "hedging", and everything to do with reaching other platforms and mediums.

Re: Negotiations Failed: How Oracle Killed Java EE

#100
post #62
post #54

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Graal Community Edition is licensed under GPL, there is a Enterprise Edition that has additional features that is licensed differently. OpenJDK does not need commercial licensing, but Oracle JDK which is built from OpenJDK needs. Then there are plenty of other vendors to chose from if you absolutely does not want to interact with Oracle. IBM and now Eclipse foundation OpenJ9 is a very interesting TCK compliant JVM, t…

GPL is not usable for any small company which doesn't want to publish its own sources. What can be used only using BSD, MIT, Apache licenses? And what from the GPL-licensed products is safe to use to produce and sell own closed source products (e.g. where the exception to GPL exists for just linking the libraries or similar)? Edit1: Long term dangers/costs of depending on the technologies that need commercial license…

> GPL is not usable for any small company which doesn't want to publish its own sources.

Maybe I'm missing something, but AFAIU you have to publish any changes to that library, not your sources.

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