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Do not leave XPS laptop in any sleep/hibernate/standby mode when placed in a bag

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Re: Do not leave XPS laptop in any sleep/hibernate/standby mode when placed in a bag

#801

Post by fouc »

Aerroon wrote: post #783
fxtentacle wrote: post #608

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Haha I should have mentioned that one as a repeat offender. After the Surface wakes up, reboots, makes noise, gets hot, and drains 20% of its battery, if I then run "powercfg.exe /lastwake" it'll pretend that it did not wake up X_X And in my case, there wasn't any non-Microsoft drivers on the system. The issue appears to be that they do magical stuff when they spot a WiFi connection, or when my WiFi router does its d…

> The issue appears to be that they do magical stuff when they spot a WiFi connection, or when my WiFi router does its daily reboot. I think that might've been my issue that kept waking up my desktop. I tried disabling everything I could to stop wake ups - to make it only wake up on pressing the power button, but I never got it to work properly. The desktop would just seemingly randomly decide that it wants to wake u…

Sometimes I turn off my laptop's wifi before putting it to sleep, and it makes a big difference in battery life.

Re: Do not leave XPS laptop in any sleep/hibernate/standby mode when placed in a bag

#802

Post by fulafel »

ayushnix wrote: post #595
Phileosopher wrote: post #496

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Same sentiment, and that's how I found Linux. I've now made it a solemn vow to convert every daily driver I have to dual-boot Win/Linux when it's a >100GB HD.

Ah right, Linux, the platform where suspend and resume doesn't even work and hibernation is a mess. AMD https://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=AMD-S2id... s2idle is broken and I have an AMD thinkpad with deep sleep and even that doesn't suspend 80% of the time. Intel (search for 'deep' and 's2idle') https://community.frame.work/t/ubuntu-21-04-on-the-framework... I already know the replies I might get but…

Linux has reliable sleep on many more laptop models than mac os. But the rule is that you need to buy known good hardware that supports Linux to have a frictionless experience. (Yes this means you often have to buy something that's been on the market for a bit of time already.) Anecdotally I've had less sleep problems than mac-using coworkers, over a long time and many laptops.

Re: Do not leave XPS laptop in any sleep/hibernate/standby mode when placed in a bag

#803

Post by zakary »

fxtentacle wrote: post #446

I stopped using my Microsoft Surface Pro because it had the same issues. It's a clusterfuck of bad design decisions at Microsoft, the most offensive one being that they prioritize the execution of their scheduled spyware upload (telemetry) over honoring the agreement with the user that a sleeping PC will remain asleep unless the user takes action. It'll even install updates at night and then make reboot sounds to wak…

I’d recommend just using a long term service channel version of Windows. It’s designed for embedded systems like MRIs so I doesn’t do any of the auto install and restart crap. Also doesn’t have the telemetry or most any other bloat ware Windows usually comes with.

Re: Do not leave XPS laptop in any sleep/hibernate/standby mode when placed in a bag

#804

Post by muststopmyths »

naikrovek wrote: post #537
fxtentacle wrote: post #446

I stopped using my Microsoft Surface Pro because it had the same issues. It's a clusterfuck of bad design decisions at Microsoft, the most offensive one being that they prioritize the execution of their scheduled spyware upload (telemetry) over honoring the agreement with the user that a sleeping PC will remain asleep unless the user takes action. It'll even install updates at night and then make reboot sounds to wak…

I mean, I know it's too late to help you, but running "powercfg.exe /lastwake" after a windows computer wakes from standby will tell you exactly what woke it up, if it knows. I've never had it return with "unknown" once in over a decade, but some people I know have. if you can find all the things waking the computer, and fix those things, it will never wake without user intervention. usually, for me, it's been device…

Windows update is one of the things that don't show up with powercfg, as far as I can recall.

My desktop used to wake itself up all the time to update and in addition to hunting down all the devices, there was a scheduled task for Office updates that I had to disable. It would wake the computer up and then Windows updates would install because the computer was awake at the scheduled time, giving me the false impression that Windows update was causing the wake.

In 8-9 years of using Surface Pros, on the other hand, I have never had one that woke from sleep to install updates or cooked itself in a bag. They have been trouble-free for me and my favorite travel computer.

Really need to look into a BSD with Windows VM for my next desktop though.

Re: Do not leave XPS laptop in any sleep/hibernate/standby mode when placed in a bag

#805

Post by BoorishBears »

bestouff wrote: post #69
tome wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What does "never wakes up" mean? I thought I had the same problem but then I discovered that closing and opening the lid is the only way to get it to wake. Neither the power button (it turns it off) nor keypresses (they do nothing) work.

I think I tried everything, from buttons to lid to magic network packets. Once in S3 it's dead Jim, and there's nothing in the BIOS to change that behavior. The irony is that I have a 4 years old XPS 13 where everything works like a charm, even under Linux. Talk about progress ...

A comment above mentions manufacturers removing S3 support from their bios with the exact symptoms you mentioned

Re: Do not leave XPS laptop in any sleep/hibernate/standby mode when placed in a bag

#806

Post by fouc »

GekkePrutser wrote: post #576
dubya wrote: post #543

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I really miss the "snoring" light that Macbooks used to have, though more to tell if the computer is actually waking up.

I really don't get why they left the light off them. It's not something that takes any space at all and they can even make it invisible when off with their micro holes like they did with the old Bluetooth keyboard. Sometimes it seems Apple is just minimalist for the sake of it. Because this is really a useful feature.

I wouldn't be surprised if they feel like macbooks are so reliable that sort of feedback isn't even necessary

Re: Do not leave XPS laptop in any sleep/hibernate/standby mode when placed in a bag

#807

Post by jrwr »

naikrovek wrote: post #726
mjaniczek wrote: post #666

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Offtopic: > or when my WiFi router does its daily reboot. Damn, I think that might fix 99% of the issues I have with my WiFi router.

I have a $300 Ubiquiti Dream Machine and that thing CANT be scheduled to reboot. doesn't matter because Ethernet dies twice a day, and I need to use my phone to get to the admin page to restart the thing. most annoying and expensive router I've ever owned. I DO NOT understand how all routers I have ever owned are total garbage, but they all have been.

The only router I've had not give me any gruff is the Mikrotik stuff, hot damn is it hard to configure as its very advanced at times, but once its configured. it /never/ goes down

Re: Do not leave XPS laptop in any sleep/hibernate/standby mode when placed in a bag

#808

Post by naikrovek »

washadjeffmad wrote: post #797
naikrovek wrote: post #726

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have a $300 Ubiquiti Dream Machine and that thing CANT be scheduled to reboot. doesn't matter because Ethernet dies twice a day, and I need to use my phone to get to the admin page to restart the thing. most annoying and expensive router I've ever owned. I DO NOT understand how all routers I have ever owned are total garbage, but they all have been.

Put it behind a UPS and buy one of their smart plugs. It'll detect internet outages and reset the connected device automatically. Also, I buy and deploy a lot of Unifi/ER equipment and that doesn't happen. I think you've noticed there's a common factor in your final statement, though.

it is a bit messed up that you think it's me. I change configs on these things only enough to get them to function, and then I leave them alone.

and what exactly could I be doing to cause random DNS failures, or to cause DHCP to fail only on Ethernet ports? these things can't be configured to do that. they're consumer-grade routers and consumer-grade routers are garbage. all of them.

every enterprise router or access point I administer at work functions just fine for years at a time.

Re: Do not leave XPS laptop in any sleep/hibernate/standby mode when placed in a bag

#809

Post by mimon »

Tuna-Fish wrote: post #800
BHSPitMonkey wrote: post #704

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The hardware and software making the decision to wake the device isn't necessarily privy to concepts like "user" or "intent"; At that layer, it's all just signals. Someone has to design the system to interpret what those signals/events are supposed to lead to (e.g. should connecting a cable to a closed laptop wake it up? What if the thing on the other end of that cable is a mouse, or a storage device, or a charger, o…

But all of those cases should be governed by a very simple overarching rule: If the laptop lid is closed, assume that it is in a closed bag with no cooling available to it. Because that is the usecase that hibernate is for. It makes laptops convenient by allowing you to just close the lid, put it in a bag, go somewhere, take it out of the bag, and then open it and continue working. If you need to tell people that the…

Except your rule isn't a rule at all, it's just you assuming everyone else has the same usage pattern as you (they don't).

Pre-covid I had many co-workers who would sit down, plug their laptop into the dock, and work the whole day without ever opening the lid.

I've also spent 15+ years with a laptop connected to my TV that never has the lid open, and I definitely expect it to wake up when I sit on the couch and wiggle the Bluetooth mouse.

Re: Do not leave XPS laptop in any sleep/hibernate/standby mode when placed in a bag

#810

Post by thebruce87m »

naikrovek wrote: post #726
mjaniczek wrote: post #666

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Offtopic: > or when my WiFi router does its daily reboot. Damn, I think that might fix 99% of the issues I have with my WiFi router.

I have a $300 Ubiquiti Dream Machine and that thing CANT be scheduled to reboot. doesn't matter because Ethernet dies twice a day, and I need to use my phone to get to the admin page to restart the thing. most annoying and expensive router I've ever owned. I DO NOT understand how all routers I have ever owned are total garbage, but they all have been.

Teltonika seem to make the least garbage routers I have tried. Lots of options to failover, reboot if pings fail etc too
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