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Install Windows the Arch Linux Way

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Re: Install Windows the Arch Linux Way

#81

Post by a1o »

vladvasiliu wrote: post #28
pbhjpbhj wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But then you'd use the same method as installing other OS and people would realise installing a Linux distro is easy. Of course MS already made it much harder with secureboot and "accidentally" wiping Linux installs when you install it second. Given the massive updates you immediately have to download, and the heavy push for only installing with an online account, there seems little reason to have anything beyond a m…

Meh, I don't have any love for windows, but IME newish versions seem quite well-behaved regarding Linux. Sure, they'll rewrite the UEFI boot order, but once you set it back to what you want, it leaves it alone. The one thing I absolutely hate, is the recovery partition at the end of the main C: drive. So that if you want to grow the C drive, you have to jump through some ridiculous hoops to move the recovery partitio…

Windows 10 and 11 still breaks dual boot, had it happen with me in two different computers. Now I just have different computers with different OSes - had to get a second desk to be able to have all mounted in a way I don't need to swap computer cables.

Re: Install Windows the Arch Linux Way

#82

Post by kiririn »

vladvasiliu wrote: post #28
pbhjpbhj wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But then you'd use the same method as installing other OS and people would realise installing a Linux distro is easy. Of course MS already made it much harder with secureboot and "accidentally" wiping Linux installs when you install it second. Given the massive updates you immediately have to download, and the heavy push for only installing with an online account, there seems little reason to have anything beyond a m…

Meh, I don't have any love for windows, but IME newish versions seem quite well-behaved regarding Linux. Sure, they'll rewrite the UEFI boot order, but once you set it back to what you want, it leaves it alone. The one thing I absolutely hate, is the recovery partition at the end of the main C: drive. So that if you want to grow the C drive, you have to jump through some ridiculous hoops to move the recovery partitio…

When you for example upgrade from windows 10 to 11, if your partitions are a mess it will shrink your main C partition to make room for a recovery partition at the end

Doesn’t really justify putting it at the end on fresh installs, but I guess they put ease of future automated repartitioning first

Re: Install Windows the Arch Linux Way

#83

Post by alexvitkov »

smabie wrote: post #43
tucosan wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I don't even want to install Arch the Arch way. Then don't. You're simply not part of the target audience.

I don't wanna install Arch the Arch way either, and I've been running Arch for over 10yrs The Installation just sucks for no purpose. Actually it's worse than that they used to have a TUI installer but then removed it

The Arch install is literally 1. partition your system 2. mount / 3. run 1 command to actually install the system 4. install grub

Sure, it's a bit gatekeepy if you haven't done it before, but it teaches you a lot of useful things about how a Linux system works, that you'll undoubtedly need if you plan to use Arch.

Re: Install Windows the Arch Linux Way

#84

Post by nsonha »

alexvitkov wrote: post #83
smabie wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't wanna install Arch the Arch way either, and I've been running Arch for over 10yrs The Installation just sucks for no purpose. Actually it's worse than that they used to have a TUI installer but then removed it

The Arch install is literally 1. partition your system 2. mount / 3. run 1 command to actually install the system 4. install grub Sure, it's a bit gatekeepy if you haven't done it before, but it teaches you a lot of useful things about how a Linux system works, that you'll undoubtedly need if you plan to use Arch.

Imagine any other consumer product boasting about teaching you things, instead of just do what it means to do.

Also am I dumb? Why do I need to be taught these things again and again every damn installation?

Re: Install Windows the Arch Linux Way

#85

Post by mschuster91 »

mananaysiempre wrote: post #70
gumballindie wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I tried installing it too, but oddly enough, it lacked drivers. Linux on the same machine runs flawlessly. I needed it for testing a new piece of software i am working on. I managed to install it after downloading a bunch of extras. Once installed it started downloading updates..and it went on and on and on. It’s such a low quality os it’s hilarious.

> oddly enough, [Windows] lacked drivers. This is the situation with the upcoming 13-inch AMD Framework, by the way: apparently the official Windows 11 installation image doesn’t include drivers for the AMD/Mediatek RZ616 Wi-Fi card (2021), so they’re going to have to tell people to use Rufus to inject one. Fedora reportedly works out of the box.

It's mind-boggling that we have utterly basic fallback standards for storage (ATA, USB Storage Class), display (VGA), USB (xHCI), webcams (USB UVC), mice/touchpads/touchscreens/keyboards (PS/2, USB HID) or Bluetooth, with BIOS usually providing emulation layers for everything of that excluding webcams and bluetooth so you can theoretically take any modern x86 PC and hand-write a basic OS in Assembler if you want and have all of that sorted out, but nothing equivalent for networking (both wired and wireless) to make bootstrapping less of a pain.

Every OS, no matter if Windows, Linux or BSD, needs to bring a crapload of drivers and binary firmware blobs with it, just to make sure networking works.

Re: Install Windows the Arch Linux Way

#86

Post by yomlica8 »

z3t4 wrote: post #10

I installed Windows recently and it didn't want to create a partition. Tried all kind of black magic (you can do a lot of stuff using the tools on the install media). Finally I copied the windows usb onto the hdd and booted from it, that did the trick.

I found this worked on my newer PC but did not work on my older z77 chipset based one, even though it supports support UEFI.

Re: Install Windows the Arch Linux Way

#87

Post by immanentize »

pbhjpbhj wrote: post #20
greatcircle wrote: post #13

I installed Windows 10 the other week - it kinda blew my mind how poor the install experience was. The iso contained files greater than 4GB, which breaks fat32, which I'm sure many people are still using on flash drives. So I had to use an MS cmd-line tool to split the wim files manually and edit the install files. Why doesn't the installer just use smaller archive files?

But then you'd use the same method as installing other OS and people would realise installing a Linux distro is easy. Of course MS already made it much harder with secureboot and "accidentally" wiping Linux installs when you install it second. Given the massive updates you immediately have to download, and the heavy push for only installing with an online account, there seems little reason to have anything beyond a m…

The title says arch and I remember trying to install it once and it's just like 'connect to wifi' and dumps me at the command line.

I managed to figure it out by digging through documentation but the installation experience was extremely rough compared to every Windows version I can remember.

Re: Install Windows the Arch Linux Way

#88

Post by Jnr »

gameoverhumans wrote: post #47
smabie wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't wanna install Arch the Arch way either, and I've been running Arch for over 10yrs The Installation just sucks for no purpose. Actually it's worse than that they used to have a TUI installer but then removed it

> Actually it's worse than that they used to have a TUI installer but then removed it Not sure what you're referring to here. Archinstall [1] is relatively recent [2]. I used it a few weeks ago to quickly yeet a machine into Arch for some testing. Worked flawlessly and had the machine from live boot -> Arch install on root media in under 5 minutes. [1]: https://wiki.archlinux.org/title/Archinstall [2]: https://www.ph…

I remember using TUI for Arch installation 10+ years ago. I think it also was named archinstall iso back then. But it had some limitations. I do prefer the way it is right now though, it seems rather simple.

Re: Install Windows the Arch Linux Way

#89

Post by leonheld »

gameoverhumans wrote: post #45
Zetobal wrote: post #29

I don't even want to install Arch the Arch way.

It sounds like you're the kind of person who wants a computer that "just works" with user-friendly point/click software out of the box. You're absolutely not the target audience of Arch Linux, nor this "Arch-like" Windows install guide. Personally, I learned more about modern Linux userspace by following the Arch install process (and subsequently maintaining an Arch install for daily-driver use) than I ever did from…

I've used Linux for more than 15 years now and my salary depends on how good I am with Linux.

Although I agree you learn a lot with these distros, nowadays I just want something that works out of the box. If you spend years professionally bringing up Linux boxes, you don't want to it in your free time...

Re: Install Windows the Arch Linux Way

#90

Post by pyr0hu »

mschuster91 wrote: post #85
mananaysiempre wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> oddly enough, [Windows] lacked drivers. This is the situation with the upcoming 13-inch AMD Framework, by the way: apparently the official Windows 11 installation image doesn’t include drivers for the AMD/Mediatek RZ616 Wi-Fi card (2021), so they’re going to have to tell people to use Rufus to inject one. Fedora reportedly works out of the box.

It's mind-boggling that we have utterly basic fallback standards for storage (ATA, USB Storage Class), display (VGA), USB (xHCI), webcams (USB UVC), mice/touchpads/touchscreens/keyboards (PS/2, USB HID) or Bluetooth, with BIOS usually providing emulation layers for everything of that excluding webcams and bluetooth so you can theoretically take any modern x86 PC and hand-write a basic OS in Assembler if you want and…

I was honestly suprised that my wireless Logitech mouse with the special Logi dongle worked in the BIOS.
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