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Finnish govt agency warns of unusual aircraft GPS interference

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Re: Finnish govt agency warns of unusual aircraft GPS interference

#81

Post by waihtis »

jl6 wrote: post #44
waihtis wrote: post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Suggesting Russians are playing a rational game here? I think the cover has been pulled on the Russian "master strategy".. it's literally a hierarchy of terror and lies, where everyone will do whatever it takes to please the irrational autocrat. I have been spamming this lecture everywhere since the war started and again I think anyone who's still questioning the Russian operative reality should watch it: Evaluation…

Even though plan A (rapid victory) appears to have failed, there is still a rational plan B: carve out the eastern and southern portions Putin wants, leave the rest of the country a smouldering ruin which will cost the west $1tn in aid to rebuild.

A rational plan would've been to confine the conflict into Donbas & Krim. I would make the argument that barely any sanctions would've been put in place if Russia had occupied the areas it was already fighting in, since the west barely cared in 2014

Re: Finnish govt agency warns of unusual aircraft GPS interference

#82

Post by j16sdiz »

fho wrote: post #79
tialaramex wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I thought the military GPS signals were encrypted I'm sure this is true in the sense that general publications use "encrypted" to mean, "There was some sort of cryptographic stuff involved and it went over my head" rather than actually encrypted. Like they do when they tell you that the passwords stolen in a breach were "encrypted with bcrypt" for example. The key thing to pay attention to here is that unlike say,…

I mean ... That's what's cryptography is for. Making sure that what you receive is from the sender you expect it from. Ie sign the current data package plus the current time. Receivers ignore everything with an incorrect timestamp and/or wrong signature. Now you only have to make sure that you don't lose your private keys.

GPS spoofing is the same signal, emitted at different time and space.

Re: Finnish govt agency warns of unusual aircraft GPS interference

#83

Post by madaxe_again »

supergirl wrote: post #73
madaxe_again wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Their entire recent comment history is contrarian “maybe the Ukrainians are Nazis, maybe they aren’t, how can anyone know”, “the Soviet Union mostly did good things”, etc. This is either a victim of Russian propaganda, or an agent of Russian propaganda. As to the presented ideas in the talk - as someone who knows Russia well, speaks Russian, has Russian family, he’s spot on - but no Russian will ever agree , because…

yeah that talk is designed to reinforce your bias by mixing a bit of history to make it look scientific. just watch a real history of Russia lecture. you’re basically watching a history lecture from a career spy instead of from a historian. and you think I am a victim of propaganda lol

Have you ever been outside of your oblast? I guarantee that I’ve seen far more of Russia than you - my views are based on far, far more than some video with which I happen to agree.

Re: Finnish govt agency warns of unusual aircraft GPS interference

#84

Post by j16sdiz »

waihtis wrote: post #60
dazc wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've only lived in 3 countries and all I have learned is that some people are good/nice/polite and some people are bad/ugly/rude regardelss of their nationality, religion or culture.

Are you then claiming that 70% of Russians are jerks? Because that's the current approval rate of Putin according to the latest post-war poll by Levada. [1] [1] https://www.levada.ru/2022/02/04/odobrenie-institutov-polozh ...

Not if the media are state controlled.

Re: Finnish govt agency warns of unusual aircraft GPS interference

#85

Post by waihtis »

j16sdiz wrote: post #84
waihtis wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are you then claiming that 70% of Russians are jerks? Because that's the current approval rate of Putin according to the latest post-war poll by Levada. [1] [1] https://www.levada.ru/2022/02/04/odobrenie-institutov-polozh ...

Not if the media are state controlled.

Yes, ergo this take of ”people are either good or evil, regardless of country, religion etc.” is proven false

Re: Finnish govt agency warns of unusual aircraft GPS interference

#86

Post by Moru »

verisimi wrote: post #40
atoav wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> So what does my anecdata tell us? Nothing. You are surely right there, but having played with a ton of kids from all nationalities as well (football, handball, whatever) this episode still stood out for me, because it was much more brutal than anything else I had experienced out of tournaments and "serious" games. The game in question here was not even a hotel tournament, it was just a "hey, wanna play a round"-kin…

Should I judge all individuals by the country they come from? Within your own country, have you met people who are great and others who are not? Even within your own school or workplace? Although governments that run countries would have you believe there is such a thing as a country - this is merely a fiction that is commonly believed. There are no countries, just beliefs. There are no collectives either - that too…

Yes ofcourse we are all the same, people. But we people have been brought up in different cultures and been fed different naratives so we act differently depending on what we have been brought up to. We can learn to be one way or other to a certain degree.

Re: Finnish govt agency warns of unusual aircraft GPS interference

#87

Post by kevincox »

chockchocschoir wrote: post #78
tialaramex wrote: post #75

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I thought the military GPS signals were encrypted I'm sure this is true in the sense that general publications use "encrypted" to mean, "There was some sort of cryptographic stuff involved and it went over my head" rather than actually encrypted. Like they do when they tell you that the passwords stolen in a breach were "encrypted with bcrypt" for example. The key thing to pay attention to here is that unlike say,…

I do know the basics of GPS but not much further than this. Wouldn't it be possible to embed a clock in a GPS receiver that gets used when decrypting the packets it receives? So instead of just receiving a encrypted packet and trusting it, it'll decrypt it and check when the message was from and if the slew is more than ~1 minute or whatever, then it is probably forged. That would at least prevent the scenario that y…

Sure it's possible but GPS is all about time. Faking the time by a fraction of a second will break the whole protocol. 1min is enough to transport the signed packets across the world.

Sky basically if your only authentication scheme is time, and the protocol is all about getting the time, it is very hard to detect proxing from other locations because the bound of accepted times basically needs to be big enough that you can be spoofed a meaningful amount.

Re: Finnish govt agency warns of unusual aircraft GPS interference

#88

Post by amelius »

speedgoose wrote: post #65

> GPS spoofing is hard to stop because the signal the satellites emit from low-Earth orbit to potentially add encryption and certificates cannot be changed. Why ? I thought the military GPS signals were encrypted. They could make a new GPS version on a new frequency with at least crypto signed messages. We can’t have such a flaw on the protocol forever.

Perhaps the aircraft they talk about don't use the military grade gps.

Re: Finnish govt agency warns of unusual aircraft GPS interference

#89

Post by amelius »

rich_sasha wrote: post #2

The clear suggestion is that it is Russia doing it. Other than as an f-u, I don’t understand why they would though. If I have an effective weapon (GPS spoofer), surely I don’t want to alert the enemy to it, lest they develop defences. So eg say NATO were overreliant on GPS, incidents of spoofing like this will cause them to rethink and reduce that reliance, or harden the system.

Perhaps they too are testing their capabilities.

Re: Finnish govt agency warns of unusual aircraft GPS interference

#90

Post by zelphirkalt »

j16sdiz wrote: post #82
fho wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I mean ... That's what's cryptography is for. Making sure that what you receive is from the sender you expect it from. Ie sign the current data package plus the current time. Receivers ignore everything with an incorrect timestamp and/or wrong signature. Now you only have to make sure that you don't lose your private keys.

GPS spoofing is the same signal, emitted at different time and space.

Which is why the GP mentioned encoding the timestamp and mentioned data packages (ergo package based one-directional communication). If by same signal you mean looking similar, but not containing the same data, then the problem is already solved. If you mean containing the same data, then there is no problem.
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