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NYT journalist hacked with Pegasus after reporting on previous hacking attempts

citizenlab.ca

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Re: NYT journalist hacked with Pegasus after reporting on previous hacking attempts

#81

Post by lifeisstillgood »

FridayoLeary wrote: post #53
OminousWeapons wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It depends on what your threat model is. If its individuals, local law enforcement, or even national law enforcement (context dependent) you are trying to hide from, you can obtain phones with cash and make it very difficult to link them to you (use a sim card bought with cash and never give out that number, use a VOIP service for your primary number, use an OS that doesn't send back much telemetry, turn off location…

What will happen when hiding even small illegal activities becomes impossible?

This depends on your threat model (what is illegal, who chooses to prosecute, etc)

I was driving home today and the satnav warned us about driving over speed limit (74 mph on UK motorway). Ok. But the solution to that is technology - and organisation. There are speed cameras on this road. But most of the time they don't take images or don't trigger an action. If every road camera triggered a warning / fine on every violation then speeding would stop in a few months.

Is that something socially beneficial ? Probably. Would it be disruptive and cause great anger and political resentment? Yes.

That is one tiny example but I think that pretty much every criminal act can be detected with technology - it's going to become which one we care enough about to prosecute and which we give up and decriminialise?

Re: NYT journalist hacked with Pegasus after reporting on previous hacking attempts

#82

Post by rapind »

zionic wrote: post #62
cronix wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> (I assume it is illegal in America, but how about Israel?) This part doesn't matter much in practicality. Like it is illegal for the US gov't to spy on their citizens. It is illegal for the UK to spy on their citizens. So the NSA made a deal with the UK. They spy on us, we spy on them, and exchange the info. There, the US didn't break the law and neither did the UK. They worked around it. We live in a shadowy world…

> Like it is illegal for the US gov't to spy on their citizens. It is illegal for the UK to spy on their citizens. So the NSA made a deal with the UK. They spy on us, we spy on them, and exchange the info. There, the US didn't break the law and neither did the UK. Let’s not mince words, this is officials of the United States of America conspiring with foreign hostile [0] powers to undermine the rights and security of…

But terrorists! Pedophiles!

Re: NYT journalist hacked with Pegasus after reporting on previous hacking attempts

#83

Post by smoldesu »

FridayoLeary wrote: post #9

So how do we protect our privacy from the advance of technology? It doesn't seem possible. Just going after NSO is useless.

You can't. It's all marketing fluff at this point, because significant enough state actors will see the ~$10,000,000 R&D cost for a few iOS/Android zero-days as a drop in the bucket. We live in a post-security world, where it's economically feasible to develop malware at a pace that outruns Blue Teams. We live in a post-privacy world because Apple and Google happily pass your data back to world governments in the name of stopping terrorism, or whatever the social cause du-jour is.

There's no escape really, your only option is to embrace the paranoia and learn to love the cat-and-mouse game, or (what most people choose) give up. Remember, this is the future you voted for when you signed up for Google Drive and bought your iPhone. This is the future you willingly supported with each ad that YouTube showed you on movie night, and the one you opted-into when you noticed you were low on popcorn and got 2-day delivery on kernels from Amazon.

Re: NYT journalist hacked with Pegasus after reporting on previous hacking attempts

#84

Post by allemagne »

stareatgoats wrote: post #72
midasuni wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

He was arrested in 2019 so your “over a decade” claim is demonstrably wrong. Could you point to amnesty international claiming belmarsh is torture?

His confinement to the Embassy of Equador since 2010 amply qualify as both imprisonment and torture [0]. If you like to argue that it does not literally qualify then I suggest you don't in the interest of not wasting everybody's time. [0] https://www.bbc.com/news/world-48473898

Are we not ignoring the fact that any internet argument regarding Julian Assange where we can seemingly only deal in maximalist, black-and-white terms is also tantamount to torture?

Re: NYT journalist hacked with Pegasus after reporting on previous hacking attempts

#85

Post by throwawayay02 »

Angostura wrote: post #80
stareatgoats wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

His confinement to the Embassy of Equador since 2010 amply qualify as both imprisonment and torture [0]. If you like to argue that it does not literally qualify then I suggest you don't in the interest of not wasting everybody's time. [0] https://www.bbc.com/news/world-48473898

I'll take that argument on - he was charged by the Swedish Prosecution Authority, extradition was agreed by the UK authorities and he sought sanctuary in the Ecudorian embassy which granted him sanctury. So which of these imprisoned him? Presumably not Ecuador. The UK for agreeing to extradict him? Sweden? Similarly - what who was the perpetrator of the torture? Ecuador for not offering sufficiently spacious accomoda…

The US as I'm sure you are not that naive.

Re: NYT journalist hacked with Pegasus after reporting on previous hacking attempts

#86

Post by hedgedoops2 »

FridayoLeary wrote: post #53
OminousWeapons wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It depends on what your threat model is. If its individuals, local law enforcement, or even national law enforcement (context dependent) you are trying to hide from, you can obtain phones with cash and make it very difficult to link them to you (use a sim card bought with cash and never give out that number, use a VOIP service for your primary number, use an OS that doesn't send back much telemetry, turn off location…

What will happen when hiding even small illegal activities becomes impossible?

Selective prosecution

Re: NYT journalist hacked with Pegasus after reporting on previous hacking attempts

#87

Post by throwawayay02 »

joe_the_user wrote: post #31
hyperstar wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Rejecting the smartphone might be a start.

I don't think you can escape the use of the smart phone. But treating them as "throw-away", as not your device, etc. I think the original landlines, which were/are a few switches connected to a write on one side and some microphones on the other, were close to inherently insecure. Phones haven't ever been "your device" whereas a laptop might, maybe be rendered trustworthy.

How can you possibly not escape the use of a smartphone?

Re: NYT journalist hacked with Pegasus after reporting on previous hacking attempts

#88

Post by travoc »

FridayoLeary wrote: post #9

So how do we protect our privacy from the advance of technology? It doesn't seem possible. Just going after NSO is useless.

Lobby your government to make selling or using cyber vulnerabilities by nations an act of war?

Very unlikely give that the US does this as much as anyone. We are all potential victims in this new form of warfare.

Re: NYT journalist hacked with Pegasus after reporting on previous hacking attempts

#89

Post by catlikesshrimp »

Why aren't political exposed persons leaving iphones? It has been known for a while that it is not secure for them.

An android tablet connecting to wifi hotspots only, or even lan only, with minimal software, and a dumb phone are more secure than iphone.

Re: NYT journalist hacked with Pegasus after reporting on previous hacking attempts

#90

Post by nix23 »

chinathrow wrote: post #16
1cvmask wrote: post #12

It would seem to be the rational thing for NSO to hack a journalist who is writing on them, so that they better prepare for what’s coming. As for all the countries that buy and use NSO, to target and kill journalists, they are all close all allies of the US and Israel. And the US and England were also spying on the journalist Julian Assange, and have kept him in prison and tortured him for over a decade. Ben Hubbard…

Rational? Maybe. Ethical? No. Legitimate? Hell no.

Fun fact, the CIA had/has a rule not to impersonate priests etc, journalist or personnel of NGO's in undercover missions (because they have a hard life in some country's already).

But then there is that excellent movie Spy Game....

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