iPad Pro • Hacker News Board

Re: iPad Pro

#771

Post by exodust » Wed, Oct 31, 2018, 1:56 PM UTC

jodrellblank wrote: post #755

exodust wrote: post #750

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Edge" refers to the edge of the device. There is no other edge metaphorical or otherwise, imho. More than definition, how metaphors are used is important. Is "edge" a metaphor when the actual edge is right there, 9mm from the screen perimeter? There is no metaphor only 'edge-to-edge' window dressing. In the same way "lightning" is not a metaphor in a discussion about thunderstorms.

As others have advised, you should look up how metaphors are used, See my other comment in this thread, there is at least six years of prior usage by multiple big tech companies describing their product's screens as "edge-to-edge" without literally meaning edge-of-device to edge-of-device, with links. And see my other other comment where I wonder why "edge-to-edge" has your goat, when Apple describing the iPad Pro as…

> there is at least six years of prior usage by multiple big tech companies

Irrelevant. This discussion was about the one and only use in town right now of "edge-to-edge" in a major campaign to sell new tablets.

"All screen" is more ambiguous. For starters "all screen" is not a pre-existing term. It could be used to mean there's no other elements or buttons on the front, except the screen. "All screen".

"Edge-to-edge" on the other hand, has explicit meaning built in. The primary component of which is measurement. "Edge-to-edge" refers to not one, but two hard edges, and describes that which spans in full from one edge to the other. There's no vague interpretation possible unless you force a square peg through round hole of English. It's either an edge-to-edge screen, or it's not.

I had to measure a washing machine recently to find out if it would fit. I measured edge-to-edge, and by that I mean the actual left edge to the actual right edge. But you knew that already without me explaining.... because I said "edge to edge".

Re: iPad Pro

#772

Post by basch » Wed, Oct 31, 2018, 3:01 PM UTC

Aloha wrote: post #595

defective wrote: post #574

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I didn't know that, so I'm glad you mentioned it. I have had at least 20 failed cables and 0 failed ports (of maybe five or six devices) in my experience with Lightning. Actually, I'm not glad you mentioned it since that makes it even more perplexing. I was glad because if a port ever failed I would not have easily diagnosed it because I thought they were pretty good. But it must be my fault the cables are failing...…

My phones seem to eat cables, at the rate of about one a year, per device, but the ports last the lifetime of the device - which is a huge improvement over microusb.

buy cables with kevlar in them. i no longer eat cables per year.

Re: iPad Pro

#773

Post by daveFNbuck » Wed, Oct 31, 2018, 3:18 PM UTC

jodrellblank wrote: post #746

daveFNbuck wrote: post #739

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What is calling it "edge-to-edge" describing? Would it be equally valid to say that it has a 20" screen as a metaphor for how large the screen is?

¯\_(ツ)_/¯ Are you equally offended that this "floor to ceiling room divider" stops a couple of inches below the ceiling? https://www.amazon.com/Royhom-Privacy-Divider-Decoration-Apa... Do you expect this "top to bottom house cleaning service" to include the chimney and roof and aerials because the "top" has a literal definition? https://top-to-bottom.cleaning/ Are you angry that "surround sound" only has a discrete n…

I think the floor to ceiling divider is meant to literally reach the ceiling. It comes in different sizes. I would be upset if I bought one that didn't quite reach the ceiling because it was a few inches shorter than advertised. I would definitely be upset if I hired someone to make a floor-to-ceiling partition and it didn't reach the ceiling, unless floor-to-ceiling had a clear well-understood different meaning in that domain.

The surround sound does literally surround you. Surrounding a person doesn't require a continuous circle.

They said it's an "all-encompassing video infrastructure for broadcast and multi-screen services." That has a pretty clear meaning that it covers everything you need regarding infrastructure in those domains. It is not a metaphor.

"Unmissable" has a second meaning, "too good or important to be missed." [1] It is a subjective statement that the episode is good.

Calling the iPad pro "magic" is the only thing here that is a metaphor.

I'm not picking this hill to die on. I asked one question. You say it's a metaphor, but neither of us have any idea what it's a metaphor for. I think what you're actually trying to argue is that it's completely meaningless marketing fluff that can be applied to any phone or tablet. Would you object to calling a feature phone edge-to-edge?

I also disagree with "all screen", which should have the same meaning as edge-to-edge. All your other Apple marketing term examples have clear meanings (except "all powerful", did they really say that?)

A metaphor is when you say one thing is something else to draw an analogy between them. It doesn't work when the something else is the same type of thing. It would not make sense to say "my car is a Lexus" as a metaphor to mean my Hyundai is nice. It wouldn't make sense to say "my car is turbocharged" to mean it's fast when it doesn't have a turbocharger. If edge-to-edge is a metaphor, I can only think it's a metaphor for a tablet with a screen that doesn't have a bezel. It seems like a straight-up lie.

My biggest issue with the edge-to-edge marketing claim here is that I have no idea what they mean by it. It was bad enough when they made that claim for the iPhone X, but the iPad pro has a huge bezel. They might as well claim it fits in the palm of your hand.

[1] https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/unmissable

Re: iPad Pro

#774

Post by partiallypro » Wed, Oct 31, 2018, 3:31 PM UTC

Arn_Thor wrote: post #738

partiallypro wrote: post #690

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Faster at -what-? People make tons of speed claims, but what is it faster at? I'll be interested to see real world bench marks. I highly doubt the new iPad Pro can outperform the newly released Surface Pro with the base i7. I mean...he did say -in the past year- and the new Surface has been available for...a few weeks. Also mind you that the new Surface line doesn't even used Intel's latest chips, the latest are 9th…

This is entirely anecdotal, but my iPad pro from last year handles photo edits (lightroom, affinity) much easier than my i5-powered desktop with a 1060 GPU. Anything from opening the file, doing edits and exporting the file in various formats is just a lot snappier on the iPad. I don't know about the surface pro

I'm not denying that the Pro is a beast of a machine, but I also think the Lightroom on iPad is a slimmed down version, no? One advantage that the iPad really has is that the code the companies like Adobe use don't have to be backward compatible with various GPUs and hardware. I'm sure there is a ton of bloat in Photoshop etc that are just there because of older machines.

I am happy that the iPad Pro is pushing the limits, it is about time that the Surface Pro line had true competition, it will push both to be better.

Re: iPad Pro

#775

Post by Invictus0 » Wed, Oct 31, 2018, 3:52 PM UTC

Terretta wrote: post #760

Invictus0 wrote: post #315

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I know you're trying to make the point that most software is bloated/slow/etc. but this is not the example to use for that point. Things don't just get faster because it's current year. The size of photos has increased by orders of magnitude since Photoshop debuted, the size of screens has increased, and the capabilities of the program have increased. In Photoshop, it is not only plausible but commonplace to have mul…

Not “orders of magnitude”, no. Demo was 12,000 x 12,000 pixels, 2 orders of magnitude would be pictures of 120 x 120 pixels. We did more with Photoshop in the past than 128px icons.

12000 x 12000 = 1.44 * 10^8 pixels.

120 x 120 = 1.44 * 10^4 pixels.

4 orders of magnitude. And in addition to that, the RAW sensor information from the camera has given each pixel more 'depth'. Often times, each color is 12bit (36bit per pixel). There's more to each pixel than what's displayed on the screen: its not just a JPG you're viewing.

Re: iPad Pro

#776

Post by kllrnohj » Wed, Oct 31, 2018, 4:03 PM UTC

jodrellblank wrote: post #683

kllrnohj wrote: post #562

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No matter what it's not a metaphor. You might want to look up what that word actually means.

I Google'd "define:metaphor" and it says "a figure of speech in which a word or phrase is applied to an object or action to which it is not literally applicable." and... Grammarly says "A metaphor is a figure of speech that describes an object or action in a way that isn’t literally true, but helps explain an idea or make a comparison." Soooo this supports the idea that "edge-to-edge" can be descriptive but not liter…

The words 'edge to edge' do literally apply to the object in question, though. You can literally have an edge-to-edge display - see the Galaxy S9+ for example.

You can't just say "well even though the words could literally apply to the object and they do literally apply to the object in some cases in this case it's 'just a metaphor'"

It's not. It'd be embellishment if you want to be generous. But not a metaphor.

Re: iPad Pro

#777

Post by kllrnohj » Wed, Oct 31, 2018, 4:08 PM UTC

sjwright wrote: post #765

kllrnohj wrote: post #414

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But they aren't even small bezels. There are still rather large bezels all around the "edge to edge" screen. This is just a blatant lie by Apple's marketing.

Their marketing begins and ends with large, high quality photographs of the product which clearly shows the bezel size. Nobody is going to be misled. Reserve your criticism for companies like LG who actually lied about their monitors: https://www.flatpanelshd.com/news.php?subaction=showfull&id=...

There's not a limit for criticism. Just because LG was worse in a particular instances doesn't mean Apple gets a free pass.

Re: iPad Pro

#778

Post by kllrnohj » Wed, Oct 31, 2018, 4:15 PM UTC

millstone wrote: post #718

tokyodude wrote: post #709

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are not legitimate security reasons for Webkit only. That makes zero sense. Chrome has hands down beat every other browser on security for years. Go read the CVEs. There is absolutely zero reason to believe that iOS webkit has a better track record than webkit at large. Therefore it's nearly certain your iOS device is less secure browsing the net with webkit/Safari than if Apple allowed real chrome to run there…

You misunderstand. Apple can fix WebKit bugs, but they can't force Google to fix Chrome bugs. Also for Apple to allow v8, they would have to permit 3rd party unsigned executable code (JITed in this case). Apple doesn't want to allow that. This is not about CVEs, it's a meta discussion of not outsourcing the security of the platform.

Which are both control issues not security issues.

There's no actual security reason for iOS to be locked to Apple's webkit exclusively and there's no actual security reason for iOS to not allow JIT'd code. Those are both control issues, not security ones. JIT in particular is purely a control issue - the process itself is already sandboxed which is the one and only actual security boundary here. Preventing a JIT doesn't prevent arbitrary code execution, after all, especially if there's an interpreter in play which Apple sort of allows.

Re: iPad Pro

#779

Post by eddieroger » Wed, Oct 31, 2018, 4:22 PM UTC

tjr wrote: post #317

eddieroger wrote: post #243

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What do you use for sheet music? I use ForScore with the Pencil, and it has been an amazing pairing that a magnet-mounted Pencil will only make better. One of my bandmates uses an Android tablet and generic stylus, and it's not even comparable how much better my setup is. I'm sure there are a dozen Android tablets with active styli, but I haven't seen them.

As a band leader, I have produced score material using Sibelius for years, and have been using Avid Scorch Sibelius file viewer on the iPad. Unfortunately, Avid seems not especially interested in supporting this product... this is a case where I can really see practical value in Free Software! I would love to be able to contribute some fixes and improvements. But it works well enough. I am looking forward to the Stei…

All of my scores are PDFs scans of actual paper music I have (and own, copyright, etc), so ForScore being a glorified PDF viewer has been more than fine for me. It's super cool to hear about alternative uses, especially around more dynamic music notation, like MusicXML (of which I know nothing).

I've done iOS dev in the past (it's not my daytime gig at the moment), so if your contemplations ever get more serious and you want an enthusiastic partner, hit me up. I'd love to do something musical.

Re: iPad Pro

#780

Post by taternuts » Wed, Oct 31, 2018, 4:51 PM UTC

adamweld wrote: post #169

calgoo wrote: post #123

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Am I the only one who actually like to have an edge on my devices so they dont break by looking at them? At least if there is a metal edge it can take some of the force and you have a chance of not breaking the screen. I dont understand why metal is bad and glass is somehow good? Also, I need to grab my ipad, move it around, spin it, grab it with the other hand etc. I see the edges / bezel's as very useful in these c…

You're not the only one. I also like a bit of a bezel or "chin" on my phones, because it makes holding the device with one hand for e.g. taking photos much more secure.

Honestly I think that can be fixed quite easily with a phone case. I actually prefer a case on my XS because it's so damned slippery if you lay it on anything with a slight slope it's falling off, and it's easier to hold.