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Why Japan is so successful at returning lost property

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Re: Why Japan is so successful at returning lost property

#61

Post by Reedx »

harikb wrote: post #32
jrsdav wrote: post #5

I experienced this while visiting Japan. While doing a transfer on the Shinkansen in Hiroshima, I left my camera bag at a noodle kiosk on the platform (around $3k worth of equipment). Didn't realize it until 2 hours after getting on the next train. When we arrived at our destination, I told my friend we were meeting (a Japanese native) what happened, and she reassured me that it would be right where I left it (said s…

Is it possible the social support structure, education, etc are creating a society where unfortunate people don't have to steal/pawn to make a living?

We tend to underestimate the effect culture can have. It's also why the Japanese don't litter their cities, despite few garbage bins.

https://www.weforum.org/agenda/2017/07/why-japanese-dont-lit...

Re: Why Japan is so successful at returning lost property

#62

Post by rb808 »

raarts wrote: post #54
drdeadringer wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> "The nail that sticks out gets knocked down." Ever since I first heard this I've kept both this phrase and the phrase "the squeaky wheel gets the grease" in mind at the same time. Basically, both sides of this coin together ask you "should you speak up?" type of thing; substitute "speak up" with whatever the given situation is.

We Dutch have a similar proverb: "Whoever sticks his head above ground level, his head is cut off. "

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crab_mentality

Re: Why Japan is so successful at returning lost property

#63

Post by kevin_thibedeau »

ookblah wrote: post #13

I found this similar mentality in Korea where you can leave your laptop, phone, etc. at a cafe completely exposed on a table while you go to the restroom or even out to lunch. When you come back your stuff will still be there. As I live in NYC, this completely blew my mind and I still felt that anxiety and awkwardness just leaving my stuff to go use the restroom. Near guaranteed theft in NYC lol. --- And to add anoth…

I lost my phone on the NYC subway. It was returned to a station and I picked it up a week later.

Re: Why Japan is so successful at returning lost property

#64

Post by supernova87a »

lawn wrote: post #60
duxup wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There was a good blog post about a guy living in Japan. Here he was in this clean and crime free place, but his bicycle kept getting trashed overnight. Just his bike parked in a sea of other bikes. He thought it was because he was a foreigner, but finally after he reported it to the police numerous times someone explained the phrase "The nail that sticks out gets knocked down." and pointed out the bikes he was buying…

Wasn't there a story a while ago how a Japanese school essentially forced (or put a lot of pressure) a schoolgirl to dye her hair to fit in with the other girls, but it failed over and over until she got burns on her head?

Another regarding gender expectations is the recent news that a (maybe more than 1?) Japanese medical school's admissions staff were rigging standardized test scores to disfavor women applicants. This is because they were seen as less reliable / career-oriented or productive (or whatever justification) for not favoring them to receive the education that men deserve.

Expectations.

Re: Why Japan is so successful at returning lost property

#65

Post by simmanian »

virtuous_signal wrote: post #10

This smells like a lot of post-hoc rationalization. Collectivism? What about China, which did terribly on this kind of test. Shintoism? Only 3-4% of the population follows that. See https://www.latimes.com/science/la-sci-people-are-honest-los... where the graphic in the middle of the page compares countries. It appears that Scandinavian countries fare best followed by Eastern European. I would be happy to hear what p…

I was born in one of the "safe" East Asian countries and I think it all comes down to their sense of ownership in the community. Koreans and Japanese have this deeply ingrained idea that the entire history of their country has been built and run by their "people" and they will have a hivemind-allergic reaction to anything they see as undesirable. There's very little crime in public in these countries because people equate a crime that happens in some back alley of a major city to a crime that happens in your cousin's backyard. It's simply abhorrent.

Needless to say, this culture does have its drawbacks, but I think the key takeaway is to increase people's sense of ownership in our communities.

Re: Why Japan is so successful at returning lost property

#66

Post by omegaworks »

nwienert wrote: post #16
virtuous_signal wrote: post #10

This smells like a lot of post-hoc rationalization. Collectivism? What about China, which did terribly on this kind of test. Shintoism? Only 3-4% of the population follows that. See https://www.latimes.com/science/la-sci-people-are-honest-los... where the graphic in the middle of the page compares countries. It appears that Scandinavian countries fare best followed by Eastern European. I would be happy to hear what p…

Homogenous, nationalistic, small country with high IQ, good education system, high GDP, low levels of immigration, and a culture that emphasizes community. Oh, and lower levels of inequality, relatively, and a more aligned politics/media system that doesn’t foment distrust.

Immigration has been steadily increasing in Japan.[1] That homogeneity presupposes trust is a right-wing stereotype used to devalue immigrants in a society and justify harsh enforcement. You can find people of every ethnicity in Tokyo, including many half and full Brazilian people that you could mistake for latinos here in the US[2].

1. https://www.japantimes.co.jp/news/2016/03/11/national/japan-...

2. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brazilians_in_Japan#Migration_...

Re: Why Japan is so successful at returning lost property

#67

Post by jessriedel »

keiferski wrote: post #38
reroute1 wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It would be easy to build an app that alarms when the battery becomes disconnected (i.e. someone walks away with your stuff). Wait what? How does this work?

This is already a thing: https://beepify.com

$19.99...

Re: Why Japan is so successful at returning lost property

#68

Post by dtwest »

jdtang13 wrote: post #40
virtuous_signal wrote: post #10

This smells like a lot of post-hoc rationalization. Collectivism? What about China, which did terribly on this kind of test. Shintoism? Only 3-4% of the population follows that. See https://www.latimes.com/science/la-sci-people-are-honest-los... where the graphic in the middle of the page compares countries. It appears that Scandinavian countries fare best followed by Eastern European. I would be happy to hear what p…

I completely agree. Foreign culture analyses like this are always tinged with bias and an incurable desire to find little small-picture justifications. I'm sick and tired of seeing every random quirk of Japanese people being explained as "Shinto this, Buddhism that"; it's such an oversimplification. The interior lives of human beings are built upon perhaps 1,000,000 variables, not just 3 variables. The writing is in…

I interpreted this particular article's main point as being:

Don't assume Japanese people are more honest than people in other countries, there are many social and cultural factors at play that influence behavior.

Generalizing a group of people is almost always inaccurate, and often frustrating to read, but I don't think this article is an egregious example of that. This is a fluff piece to get people interested in the 2020 Olympics in Tokyo, don't mistake it for serious cultural analysis.

Re: Why Japan is so successful at returning lost property

#69

Post by kube-system »

someone7x wrote: post #36
GuB-42 wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why? That's the kind of question that makes up the entire field of game theory. In every situation, the most natural strategy is to maximize personal gains. That's how natural selection works. But when people don't act like that, it means there must be some opposing force, normally one that benefits society. There is a lot to learn here, in fields as diverse as biology, economics, computing, and of course, games.

> In every situation, the most natural strategy is to maximize personal gains. The iterated prisoner's dilemma begs to differ. There are many many situations where cooperation is both natural and optimal.

> optimal

i.e., there is something in it for them. It doesn't have to be a tangible thing, it could be a simple as self-satisfaction.

Re: Why Japan is so successful at returning lost property

#70

Post by shadofx »

vkou wrote: post #52
factsaresacred wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The Cultural Revolution was unlike the political revolutions of Eastern Europe. It was a bloody orgy of violence and vandalism that attempted to tear traditional Chinese culture out from the roots, and in the process destroyed China's social fabric and trust, perhaps irreparably (or at least until the Party collapses and the country can confront its past - something the Eastern European nations have been allowed to d…

The cultural revolution was not the cause of this. Chinese history did not start in 1966. 1966 was preceded by six decades of brutal military occupation, a complete breakdown of law and order, and civil war. I'm not sure you can point at any country that had gone through such a violent, unstable, and lengthy period of fragmentation and bloodshed, and came out on the other end as a cohesive, high-trust society.

Taiwan and South Korea were both bloody, autocratic military regimes. Many nations have walked the bridge to hell and back, but the cultural revolution meant that China burned the bridge after crossing it.
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