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Volkswagen, Porsche, and Audi say they will use Tesla's EV charging plug

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Re: Volkswagen, Porsche, and Audi say they will use Tesla's EV charging plug

#591

Post by midasuni »

kevin_thibedeau wrote: post #495
akouri wrote: post #195

I am the founder of Starlight Charging[1]. We are working on crazy-low-cost L2 chargers for multifamily apartments. Plug-and-charge is a sine-qua-non for us. One still major unsolved problem is the lack of agreement on a standard for payment/powerline communication from the EVSE to the vehicle. OCPP 2.0.1 and ISO 15118 is supposed to bring "Plug and Charge" capabilities -- this, in theory, would allow drivers to simp…

How will you pay with cash under such a regime? No EVs for the poor, let them eat cake.

Buy a prepaid card. Just like you have to do now for large numbers of places - including filling up with gas at many places.

Re: Volkswagen, Porsche, and Audi say they will use Tesla's EV charging plug

#592

Post by ffgjgf1 »

mendigou wrote: post #456
Acinyx wrote: post #378

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In europe the connections are a lot lower amperage, around here for example 35 ampere per phase. But having 3 phases is pretty normal and the standard in any new house, which means 3 phases can let you charge at 22kW with a few Ampere left, while with 1 phase you can only charge at 7 KW. That does make it useful to charge it in a few hours in the afternoon, instead of having to wiat the night.

In which European country is triphasic power for houses becoming normal?

Where I am (Eastern Europe) the cost difference is insignificant. There is no reason to not get triphasic for new detached/semi-detached houses.

Re: Volkswagen, Porsche, and Audi say they will use Tesla's EV charging plug

#593

Post by ffgjgf1 »

93po wrote: post #348
jorvi wrote: post #242

Earlier quoted context omitted.

NACS is fundamentally incompatible for 3-phase power. You need a live, a neutral, a ground, and two extra wires for each extra phase. I’ll take my chunky connector with 22kW over your sleek one with 7kW :)

Super chargers can charge a Tesla up to 250kw

The cost of getting one is what?

I have a 22kW CCS charger at home and it is seems perfectly fine.

Re: Volkswagen, Porsche, and Audi say they will use Tesla's EV charging plug

#594

Post by apexalpha »

hnburnsy wrote: post #558
moogly wrote: post #478

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A law was passed earlier this year that means mandatory card/contactless payment, and prices clearly shown (as opposed being hidden in an app). Unclear exactly when it will be enacted though.

Thanks, what do the unbanked do in the EU? Some local cities have banned cashless stores, wonder if this will apply to EV chargers which seem to be unmanned.

>Thanks, what do the unbanked do in the EU?

Prepaid debit cards? Or otherwise charging at home / workplace.

Re: Volkswagen, Porsche, and Audi say they will use Tesla's EV charging plug

#595

Post by ffgjgf1 »

tw04 wrote: post #155
phkahler wrote: post #140

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>> Owning the charging network is a nice hedge against losing the battle to become one of the platforms. Charging networks are IMHO not a viable long term business model. Building out a "platform" to sell commodity electrons is utterly stupid. Nobody wants the stupid app, they want to charge at McDonalds along the highway while they grab something to eat.

>Charging networks are IMHO not a viable long term business model. Sort of like gas stations weren't a viable long-term business model? > Nobody wants the stupid app, they want to charge at McDonalds along the highway while they grab something to eat. So you should put your chargers near convenient amenities... like a convenience store... like a gas station?

> Sort of like gas stations weren't a viable long-term business model?

If you only sell gas and nothing else you can only compete on price. Good luck with that.

Re: Volkswagen, Porsche, and Audi say they will use Tesla's EV charging plug

#596

Post by masklinn »

hcal wrote: post #386
brnt wrote: post #375

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So, I haven't got the money for an electric car... One just can't use the payment card at a bog standard self service payment terminal? I had assumed that, but apparently no? You seriously visit random websites and enter CC details?

Right, many or most don't have credit card terminals. You plug in, load an app, find you station, select a port number, tell it to start and hope it works. It doesn't sound that bad, but the chargers janky, the apps are janky and it takes a long time often with multiple attempts.

> It doesn't sound that bad

It does tho, even before getting into the reliability issues I don’t want to have to install random applications.

Re: Volkswagen, Porsche, and Audi say they will use Tesla's EV charging plug

#597

Post by apexalpha »

stephenr wrote: post #566
apexalpha wrote: post #190

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It was designed by VW I think, who handed it over to other car companies so there could be a universal connector. The reason it's bigger is because it supports 3-phase power, which NACS does not. 3-phase power is a big thing in Europe.

The CCS Type 2 plug was designed by Mennekes - it's even referred to as "Mennekes plug" in some places.

I stand corrected! Thanks

Re: Volkswagen, Porsche, and Audi say they will use Tesla's EV charging plug

#598

Post by TheAlchemist »

grecy wrote: post #562
TheAlchemist wrote: post #518

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, but that was on the investor day - a lot of stupid things was said on that day. Like, and I quote here, "demand for our existing vehicles in terms of the desire to own them might as well be infinite"... Yeah, infinite demand for sure ! That's certainly why they were cutting prices aggressively.

> Yeah, infinite demand for sure ! That's certainly why they were cutting prices aggressively. The Model Y is now the second best selling vehicle in the US, and the number one in the world. They're selling every single vehicle they can make, right on 2 million vehicles this year. So far, demand continues to exceed production.

Is that true ?

As far as we know, the factories are not operating at full capacity and the inventory increased considerably lately. And this is despite the price cuts.

Re: Volkswagen, Porsche, and Audi say they will use Tesla's EV charging plug

#599

Post by merb »

btw there are provider networks in Europe where you subscribe to a single provider and you can charge nearly anywhere. It’s just that other providers have a roaming fee, which sometimes is double the price, which makes it a little bit stupid. Roaming should either be free or add minimal overhead like 2cent maximum over the costs of the other provider

Re: Volkswagen, Porsche, and Audi say they will use Tesla's EV charging plug

#600

Post by Symbiote »

ffgjgf1 wrote: post #582
matthewdgreen wrote: post #579

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Visa charges a 5-10 cent fixed fee plus a percentage for those 1 Euro transactions. Presumably public transport just eats those costs, but in a commodity business like electricity I imagine it’s a noticeable chunk of the profit margin.

1 cent fixed fee + percentage seems to be the standard where I am. It might be difficult in other EU countries but IIRC the fixed fee is capped at 5cents.

The only public information I can find is this, which is from 2013 in London:

Visa credit 0.65%, debit 1 pence. Mastercard credit 0.80%, debit 1 pence + 0.5%.

https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/costs_to_tfl_for_cont...

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