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Blue-collar wages are surging. Can it last?

economist.com

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Re: Blue-collar wages are surging. Can it last?

#591

Post by lloyd-christmas »

raarts wrote: post #590
lloyd-christmas wrote: post #566

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If what you're quoting is what you are actually responding to, you've missed the point. That quote is a comparison between a UPS driver and a Doctor, not a Doctor in the US and one in Norway. If you're trying to compare countries, you're not paying twice as much once you account for what goes into achieving that income .

Maybe I didn't get my point across, but what I was getting at: salaries really have to do with the extreme healthcare costs in the US. https://www.politico.com/agenda/story/2017/10/25/doctors-sal... (Also on HN today)

I've commented on that one as well. Feel free to read those.

Re: Blue-collar wages are surging. Can it last?

#592

Post by wyclif »

roel_v wrote: post #551
wyclif wrote: post #537

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was a land surveyor from 2000-2008, it's a subset of civil engineering. But unlike CE, there's a lot of field work and a small amount of office work. In my case I'd say it was anywhere from 80-90% field and 10-20% office. But even though surveying is hardly unskilled labour and usually requires a degree, it was still subject to the same effects the grandparent comment mentions: constant layoffs in winter, culminati…

So what are you saying? Surveyor pay is booming now, or no surveying is needed any more? ('Needed' as in, people are actually paying to get it done, not 'needed' as in 'people theorize that it would be useful')

The point I'm trying to make is in support of the grandparent comment in this thread: not many young people choose land surveying as a career because even though it's hugely needed and necessary to create the built environment, it's boom or bust. You can't be trained properly and stay in the job if you're getting laid off every winter. And since LS is protected by a guild (professional licensure), this drives prices up.

Re: Blue-collar wages are surging. Can it last?

#593

Post by ErikAugust »

prawn wrote: post #475
ErikAugust wrote: post #253

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have a friend who is a general manager that deals in part-time, odd hour unskilled labor who spoke of a similar story. What do you think, time to build and monetize a solution to solve this problem? I think I have some ideas to help with this type of worker onboarding and retention, personally.

At the very least, it'd be worth contacting the noshows and finding out the reasons, encouraging them to be honest. Work out what it might be - - got another job but forgot to tell you - changed my mind - just too tired or busy - didn't think I had a real chance, so I didn't bother - too nervous about the interview

Good call.

Re: Blue-collar wages are surging. Can it last?

#594

Post by Consultant32452 »

wils1245 wrote: post #581
Consultant32452 wrote: post #348

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Every white collar job I've held in the last decade had mandatory drug tests.

What sector are you in?

Here's the sectors I've worked in throughout my career: Insurance, banking, marketing, entertainment (theme park), restaurants, and defense. Every single one of my jobs in those sectors required drug tests prior to employment.

Re: Blue-collar wages are surging. Can it last?

#595

Post by roel_v »

wyclif wrote: post #592
roel_v wrote: post #551

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So what are you saying? Surveyor pay is booming now, or no surveying is needed any more? ('Needed' as in, people are actually paying to get it done, not 'needed' as in 'people theorize that it would be useful')

The point I'm trying to make is in support of the grandparent comment in this thread: not many young people choose land surveying as a career because even though it's hugely needed and necessary to create the built environment, it's boom or bust. You can't be trained properly and stay in the job if you're getting laid off every winter. And since LS is protected by a guild (professional licensure), this drives prices…

Yes I got that. My point was: as far as I know, surveyors aren't raking in $250k plus salaries (probably 'Labor shortage' is always 'I can't find people at the price I originally thought I'd have to pay', modulo some time lag dependent on the exact skill set (i.e., training time).

Re: Blue-collar wages are surging. Can it last?

#596

Post by golergka »

crankylinuxuser wrote: post #575
golergka wrote: post #559

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> So, the "I know you are but what am I?" defense? Can you elaborate? > Capitalism fails for many. Once again, if you fail, it doesn't mean that the system fails. The system's goal is not to make your life good. Why would it be?

> Once again, if you fail, it doesn't mean that the system fails. And I refuse the very premise you're working with. We're only as strong as the weakest members. And I see those members begging on the streets, or wandering around because of untreated psychiatric issues. Or they're living in tents off in the back part of the city park. There's always going to be someone with more, for whatever reasons. But there shoul…

> We're only as strong as the weakest members.

What "we" are you talking about? These members are not my family members or friends; what you're doing is abusing other people's empathy to push your agenda through emotional means instead of rational.

> But there should be nobody homeless. There should be nobody going hungry. There should be nobody without medical treatment.

Why on Earth is that an invariant on society?

Re: Blue-collar wages are surging. Can it last?

#597

Post by freeone3000 »

Consultant32452 wrote: post #348
lostlogin wrote: post #250

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I hate the drug testing bs. How is that relevant? If the worker is present, is sober, and not hungover what business is it of the employers what the employee does on their own time? The drugs that are readily detectable are mostly the ones that don’t matter too, while the ones that are more concerning (to me anyway) are either not tested for or are not detectable fairly fast. And alcohol is ok to abuse. Why? It would…

Every white collar job I've held in the last decade had mandatory drug tests.

I've been in tech for seven years and never been drug tested.

Re: Blue-collar wages are surging. Can it last?

#598

Post by VLM »

ars wrote: post #419
sillysaurus3 wrote: post #347

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Some smokers are smart, though. I wonder if it's another kind of test?

If you are unable to refrain for 2 weeks, then you are not the kind of person who they want to hire, because it means you will also not refrain when you are on duty.

Its a different sort of refrain problem. We expect you'll refrain from activity X when we tell you to for a short reasonable period of time. When X is smoking weed this is seen as a big problem, mostly by weed smokers. When X is applying electrical power to this machine's cabinet someone is working in by hacking around the lockout-tagout locks, this seems a common sense test for a jobsite. We can't test for the latter but we can proactively predict by testing for the former. There are plenty of blue collar jobs where lack of awareness and self control and logical analysis of cause and effect mean someone dies. Weed smoking is a simple test of self awareness and self control and intelligence (WRT understanding the whole problem situation)

Re: Blue-collar wages are surging. Can it last?

#599

Post by GFischer »

ryandrake wrote: post #547
ajross wrote: post #522

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Consumer services aren't really the point being made upthread, it's employers looking for supervised labor who can tolerate some spread in skills. But you can do this too: call up the elite contractors who you can't schedule because they're "too busy" and give them a big number upfront. "I need my carpets replaced, I figure this will be $30k, does that sound right?". They'll be there. But you have to do the work to k…

If someone called me up and said, "I've got a software development contract opportunity for you in Country X, $1000/hr, job should be about 6 months." My ass would be on a plane that afternoon. So much for the shortage of software developers.

I would do that for $100/hr :) .

However, there's quite a lot of friction hiring unknown software developers (so I guess that's why I don't get those offers - I'm not actively hunting for them).

Re: Blue-collar wages are surging. Can it last?

#600

Post by m0llusk »

alextheparrot wrote: post #52
bdamm wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Now grab a 3ft section of copper tubing, cut it to length with your pipe cutter, bend it with your copper bending tool, and flare it with your flare clamp... what, you don't have any of those? Wellll.."

Great! There’s an opportunity for same day rental delivery here too

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