How Israeli actions caused famine in Gaza, visualized • Hacker News Board

Re: How Israeli actions caused famine in Gaza, visualized

#571

Post by grumple » Thu, Oct 02, 2025, 11:41 PM UTC

The IPC standard says for famine to be declared:

> at least two in every 10,000 people die each day from starvation, or from malnutrition and disease.

Gaza population is 2 million * 2/10000 = 400 people dying per day in order for it to be a famine.

> After more than 700 days of war, 455 Palestinians have died of malnutrition or starvation, including 151 children, the health ministry in Gaza reported on October 1. One hundred and seventy-seven of the total number have died of malnutrition or starvation since the IPC confirmed famine on August 15, it said.

Is 455 in 700 days more than 400 per day? I don’t know, I’m having trouble doing math. Perhaps the people of HN can tell me the IPC standard is being met as the CNN article states?

Media and general literacy is apparently impossible even for journalists.

Re: How Israeli actions caused famine in Gaza, visualized

#572

Post by dttze » Thu, Oct 02, 2025, 11:41 PM UTC

tsimionescu wrote: post #120

starik36 wrote: post #97

* * *

Killing 736 Israeli civilians, 79 foreign nationals, and 379 Israeli military and security personnel, and kidnapping an additional 250 civilians is not, by any fathomable definition, genocide. It is a war crime for sure, but it's not genocide. Edit: the post I was replying to was claiming Hamas/the Palestinians perpetrated a genocide in Israel. It has since been edited to be a completely different thing.

[dead]

Re: How Israeli actions caused famine in Gaza, visualized

#573

Post by NoMoreNicksLeft » Thu, Oct 02, 2025, 11:42 PM UTC

jstanley wrote: post #212

NoMoreNicksLeft wrote: post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

I didn't downvote you but I have no idea what you're trying to say. It's a style of post common in twitter, where you obliquely refer to several things that you personally are familiar with and assume that the reader will understand because they should have basically entirely the same things on their mind that you do.

>where you obliquely refer to several things that you personally are familiar with

It's sad, I suppose, that you are unfamiliar with the basics such that you can't much discuss (or even follow) current events.

The Third Temple refers to a predicted temple that jews believe they are destined to build some point in the future. Unfortunately, there is an Islamic mosque in the only spot in the world they can/will build it. This is in the West Bank. I don't know how anyone who grew up hearing about Israel/Palestine on the news for the last 20 years wouldn't at least get the vague idea of what I'm talking about. I'll try to have Cliff Notes published for each of my comments published a few weeks before from now on.

Re: How Israeli actions caused famine in Gaza, visualized

#574

Post by JumpCrisscross » Thu, Oct 02, 2025, 11:42 PM UTC

xdennis wrote: post #560

buyucu wrote: post #493

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Israel has killed more civilians in a year, than Hamas has in its entire existence. This was has been initiated by Israel invading Palestine.

The only reason more Israelis haven't died is because Israel builds bunkers and iron dome rockets to protect its civilians. Hamas builds tunnels to protect its rockets and hides among civilians. You can't compare the death of people who are willing to release 1027 terrorists to get back just one solider to the death of people who are taught from kindergarten to kill and die for Allah. [1] Nobody criticizes Britain be…

> Nobody criticizes Britain because it killed more Nazi civilians

The bombing of Dresden has absolutely been condemned. British area bombing was contemporaneously criticised by America. It's why we flew our bombers in the day, despite that meaning more of them got shot down--so they could see what they'd hit.

Re: How Israeli actions caused famine in Gaza, visualized

#575

Post by grumple » Thu, Oct 02, 2025, 11:45 PM UTC

phgn wrote: post #409

Two numbers on the effectiveness of that strategy: 680.000 and 380.000. The total number of Palestinians murdered, and the number of those who were kids under 5 years old. source: https://arena.org.au/politics-of-counting-gazas-dead/

Completely absurd projection not supported by any serious sources. That would mean 1 in 3 Gazans dead, and 10 deaths per reported death, which would be completely out of line with other conflicts.

Re: How Israeli actions caused famine in Gaza, visualized

#576

Post by JumpCrisscross » Thu, Oct 02, 2025, 11:45 PM UTC

LightBug1 wrote: post #518

TrnsltLife wrote: post #501

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Of all people?

I don't know much about Charlie Kirk except what I've read recently. But he does/did seem to be part of a growing element of the right in the USA who stand against Israel and Netanyahu specifically. And while I support that, I don't think it's necessarily to support Palestinians, but more as an America First policy. In that context, "of all people" makes sense to me. I too have been surprised by the move, of some on…

> I too have been surprised by the move, of some on the right, against Israel, considering their almost unanimous support previously

The right is not a monolith. Various elements on the right have always been anti-Israel, from the non-interventionists to the straight-up racists. Kirk was one of the former.

Re: How Israeli actions caused famine in Gaza, visualized

#577

Post by samirillian » Thu, Oct 02, 2025, 11:45 PM UTC

dirtikiti wrote: post #556

softwaredoug wrote: post #479

I've heard it said by eliminating all other avenues of Palestinian political expression, Netanyahu created modern Hamas. He undermined the two-state solution and Palestinian Authority. When you do this, you back people into a corner. There's no path to peacefully making progress on anything you care about. It also conveniently gives Netanyahu a boogeyman for his own political ends. You might argue the PA was corrupt,…

[flagged]

Do you think what Israel is doing is right?

Re: How Israeli actions caused famine in Gaza, visualized

#578

Post by ipaddr » Thu, Oct 02, 2025, 11:47 PM UTC

danielbenzvi1 wrote: post #484

ipaddr wrote: post #475

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Benjamin Netanyahu funded Hamas in the 90s. So this is where we are. If they allowed the PLO to manage we would have two states already.

The idea that simply empowering the PLO would have produced peace ignores the reality of what happened when they were empowered. After Oslo, Israel handed over cities in the West Bank and gave the Palestinian Authority control in Gaza. Instead of building the foundations of a peaceful state, the PLO leadership became riddled with corruption, failed to create functioning institutions, and tolerated or even encouraged…

It’s true that the post-Oslo period exposed serious failures in Palestinian leadership, but the picture isn’t one-sided. The Palestinian Authority was granted limited autonomy under Oslo, not true sovereignty. Israel retained control over borders, resources, movement, and security, meaning the PLO never had the conditions to fully build a state. Corruption and mismanagement within the PA certainly damaged trust, but so did ongoing settlement expansion, restrictions on movement, and the lack of progress toward final status negotiations.

The Second Intifada was indeed devastating and eroded faith on both sides, but framing it only as a PLO decision ignores the buildup of frustration from years of unfulfilled promises and worsening conditions on the ground. Empowering the PLO in a genuine way, with real authority, accountability mechanisms, and mutual commitment to peace, might have led to a different outcome.

In other words, both leadership failures and structural limitations played roles. Reducing it to "the PLO blew it" risks oversimplifying a very complex situation.

Re: How Israeli actions caused famine in Gaza, visualized

#579

Post by machina_ex_deus » Thu, Oct 02, 2025, 11:52 PM UTC

lern_too_spel wrote: post #558

machina_ex_deus wrote: post #499

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

> There Palestinians simply preferred hamas and terrorism over the PLO.... They need to commit to non violence between themselves before it's possible to commit to non violence with their enemies. Hamas won 44% of the vote and then, as you noted, they murdered their political opposition. For this, everybody in Gaza should suffer both under a terrorist group running their lives and Israel bombing them?

[flagged]

Re: How Israeli actions caused famine in Gaza, visualized

#580

Post by ashirusnw » Thu, Oct 02, 2025, 11:53 PM UTC

monocasa wrote: post #347

SilverElfin wrote: post #322

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s not been under a “blockade” for even a year continuously. Literally earlier this year, hundreds of trucks carrying aid were allowed in per day . That was during the ceasefire that didn’t last. If you go back to the history of blockades of Gaza you’ll see it was very intermittent. And when things were tightened, it was in response to incidents like Hamas rocket attacks.

The requirement is about five hundred trucks per day of food (so each truck feeding about four thousand people). The fact that on rare occasions they'd let in about half that isn't really a point in your favor.

Untrue. Your quoting total imports (eg concrete that was largely misappropriated to build Hamas tunnels). The amount of food delivery on average is comparable to before the war.