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India follows EU's example in requiring USB-C charging for smart devices

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Re: India follows EU's example in requiring USB-C charging for smart devices

#51

Post by crote »

constantcrying wrote: post #39
ho_schi wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The EU is watching the USB-IF for further improvements. Currently it is limited to 100 Watt and common devices like latops and smartphones. And they're watching wireless-charging already. If Apple or some of the other usual suspects (Microsoft, Amazon, Google) tries to push a proprietary technology the can act hopefully quicker. https://ec.europa.eu/commission/presscorner/detail/en/QANDA_... I'm still looking for the…

I think it is disingenous to compare USB-C to power plugs. USB-C does a million more things than power delivery and there is significantly more room for innovation. > Nobody prevents any manufacturer to add additional charging ports. Except for market demands of smaller phones. My question to you is: would you have wanted micro-USB to be standardized like this?

Micro-USB was standardized like this. And the law included a clause that said it had to be reviewed regularly to keep up with industry progress - which is why it is now switching to USB-C.

Re: India follows EU's example in requiring USB-C charging for smart devices

#52

Post by wongarsu »

jacknews wrote: post #2

Good job. Basically anything up to 100w, unless it has some other niche requirement (waterproof, etc) should be mandated USB C, IMHO.

That's basically the EU's requirement. Mobile phones get all the coverage, but the requirement covers mobile phones, tablets, digital cameras, headphones and headsets, handheld videogame consoles, portable speakers, e-readers, keyboards, mice, portable navigation systems, earbuds and laptops; as long as they are rechargeable via a wired cable that delivers up to 100w.

Re: India follows EU's example in requiring USB-C charging for smart devices

#53

Post by constantcrying »

mrtksn wrote: post #28
andybak wrote: post #8

I'm sure I'm not the first person to raise this concern but when tech improves to the point where there's a better option to USB C (or USB C is holding back other advances), are we going to have to wait for legislation to catch up before we can adopt it?

Why would that be a problem at all? If a significant advance in charging connectors is made, they can simply amend the law. These laws don't say you can't make better chargers, they say if you make a mass produced device from the provided categories and it's going to charge by cable you will need to make sure that it has at least one USB-C charging port. Besides, this is only in EU(and India now). Sure, there's a Bru…

>If a significant advance in charging connectors is made, they can simply amend the law.

How would the makers of these laws know this? How would you determine the quality of a connector if you do not have benchmarks like manufacturer adoption, market demand, longevity in the field?

What will effectively happen is that the USB implementers forum will become a state(s) sponsored organization with a monopoly on defining charging connectors. They will not have any competition, because any company which might want to compete has to first comvince the government(s) that their standard is superior, without being allowed to roll it out.

Re: India follows EU's example in requiring USB-C charging for smart devices

#54

Post by gherkinnn »

mlindner wrote: post #27
nullcipher wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why the whataboutism? Just cheer the progress.

Mandating standards by laws isn't progress. It holds the future back. This and the EU will be looked back on as a disastrous piece of legislation in the future. It's amazing how nearsighted these governments are being. Standards are universally created by industry organically, not created by governments.

This organic standard has failed completely.

I have to serve five different charging ports (Magsafe, Lightning, USB C, micro USB, and some proprietary thing for my watch). The watch charger only comes with an USB A cable, so now either I need an extra dongle or two charging bricks.

USB C was introduced in 2014 and really came about in 2016. These companies had six+ years to converge on something reasonable. But they didn't. Be it out of greed or plain laziness.

So yes, this law is an improvement.

Re: India follows EU's example in requiring USB-C charging for smart devices

#55

Post by noselasd »

input_sh wrote: post #33
constantcrying wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is also my problem with this legislation. There is legitimate innovation in connector design. Surely people remember micro USB cables, which weren't really that good. I certainly never would have wanted them to become a mandated standard. While I think USB-C is quite well designed, this legislation makes it extremely hard for a superior standard to arise. The only reason USB-C has any grounds to be a mandated st…

Micro USB was the EU standard, you already lived through that. That's why every Android and gadget out there used it, as opposed to 50 other connectors before that on feature phones. Apple found a loophole around it by shipping a dongle with iPhones. With the update to the standard that loophole was closed.

While it was a EU standard, was it also an EU law ?

If so, is the law removed, or is everyone breaking that law these days(As I don't see any phones being sold with micro-usb) but noone cares ?

Re: India follows EU's example in requiring USB-C charging for smart devices

#56

Post by cesarb »

philliphaydon wrote: post #31

I wonder if other companies will follow Apple in crippling USB-C. https://www.xda-developers.com/iphone-15-models-different-us...

Not using an optional part of the standard is not "crippling" USB-C. And yes, I believe there are already Android phones which have only USB 2, or only USB 2 plus Gen 1x1 (5 Gbit/s) USB 3.

Re: India follows EU's example in requiring USB-C charging for smart devices

#57

Post by izacus »

anshumankmr wrote: post #9

I have a gaming laptop, that won't work with USB C, right? EDIT: looks like that's not going to change

It's common for newer gaming laptops to have both USB-C and proprietary charging capability. When not under load, the 65W or 100W suffices for charging.

Re: India follows EU's example in requiring USB-C charging for smart devices

#58

Post by the_mitsuhiko »

constantcrying wrote: post #39
ho_schi wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The EU is watching the USB-IF for further improvements. Currently it is limited to 100 Watt and common devices like latops and smartphones. And they're watching wireless-charging already. If Apple or some of the other usual suspects (Microsoft, Amazon, Google) tries to push a proprietary technology the can act hopefully quicker. https://ec.europa.eu/commission/presscorner/detail/en/QANDA_... I'm still looking for the…

I think it is disingenous to compare USB-C to power plugs. USB-C does a million more things than power delivery and there is significantly more room for innovation. > Nobody prevents any manufacturer to add additional charging ports. Except for market demands of smaller phones. My question to you is: would you have wanted micro-USB to be standardized like this?

USB-C as a connector is fine for many years and backwards compatible improvements are more than possible. Once we outgrown this I’m sure lobby groups will be sitting in Brussels.

Re: India follows EU's example in requiring USB-C charging for smart devices

#59

Post by izacus »

andybak wrote: post #8

I'm sure I'm not the first person to raise this concern but when tech improves to the point where there's a better option to USB C (or USB C is holding back other advances), are we going to have to wait for legislation to catch up before we can adopt it?

Last I checked the EU part of legislation, it has an expiry built into the process.

Re: India follows EU's example in requiring USB-C charging for smart devices

#60

Post by vitium_casiri »

jeroenhd wrote: post #12
bnt wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But imagine the size of that power brick.

I believe 240W charging uses 50V@±5A. Looking at a 240W power adapter ( https://www.slimq.uk/products/240w-charger-1 ) the whole thing doesn't seem that much bigger than a regular old laptop charger. Modern GaN chargers are quite compact for the punch they pack.

They don't make it clear but it seems like that only supports 240 watt over the barrel plug.
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