Live data from Hacker News

India follows EU's example in requiring USB-C charging for smart devices

theregister.com

21–30 of 222 posts

Re: India follows EU's example in requiring USB-C charging for smart devices

#21
post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Other charging options are allowed, it's just that there should _also_ be a USB-C option.

Ah, right. I missed this nuance in the debate. In which case I wholeheartedly approve.

You approve of having to have two charging ports in one smartphone?

Re: India follows EU's example in requiring USB-C charging for smart devices

#22
post #8

I'm sure I'm not the first person to raise this concern but when tech improves to the point where there's a better option to USB C (or USB C is holding back other advances), are we going to have to wait for legislation to catch up before we can adopt it?

Literally from the law:

> The application of the laws to new charging technologies should be regularly reviewed.

Re: India follows EU's example in requiring USB-C charging for smart devices

#23
post #8

I'm sure I'm not the first person to raise this concern but when tech improves to the point where there's a better option to USB C (or USB C is holding back other advances), are we going to have to wait for legislation to catch up before we can adopt it?

No post body was provided.

Re: India follows EU's example in requiring USB-C charging for smart devices

#24
post #8

I'm sure I'm not the first person to raise this concern but when tech improves to the point where there's a better option to USB C (or USB C is holding back other advances), are we going to have to wait for legislation to catch up before we can adopt it?

This is also my problem with this legislation. There is legitimate innovation in connector design. Surely people remember micro USB cables, which weren't really that good. I certainly never would have wanted them to become a mandated standard.

While I think USB-C is quite well designed, this legislation makes it extremely hard for a superior standard to arise. The only reason USB-C has any grounds to be a mandated standard is because it already is widely used. For an alternative standard to arise, first you would need to convince multiple nation state governments and/or a multi-nation government to allow the standard to be used, even before it made it to market.

Re: India follows EU's example in requiring USB-C charging for smart devices

#25
post #8

I'm sure I'm not the first person to raise this concern but when tech improves to the point where there's a better option to USB C (or USB C is holding back other advances), are we going to have to wait for legislation to catch up before we can adopt it?

Probably yes: but that also means you can't just obsolete people's investments in USB-C. I still remember the era when you could get all sorts of iPod stands and furniture with 30-pin connectors in. Those hung around for years after Apple decided to make them worthless.

Re: India follows EU's example in requiring USB-C charging for smart devices

#26
post #8

I'm sure I'm not the first person to raise this concern but when tech improves to the point where there's a better option to USB C (or USB C is holding back other advances), are we going to have to wait for legislation to catch up before we can adopt it?

The real solution is to not legislate a standard, but instead to say: "A 10% additional tax shall apply to the sale of any portable device. The tax will be reduced to zero if the device uses the most common charging port in the year the device was sold. The tax is reduced to 5% if it uses the 2nd most common port in the year it was sold." That means any big industry effort to move to a new port will, when it gets mor…

Yes and no. This is a short/mid-term directive and as well a power-plug standard. Which is common across the world for decades. We all happily live with that already. Anyway, your basic idea is leading in a good direction and shall cover all important features:

    * Replacement parts for 5 (smartphone), 10, 15, 20, 25 or 30 (plane) years
    * Open specification for replacement parts (manufacturer goes out of business, third parties take over)
    * Maintenance manuals. Like Lenovo provides for ThinkPads with explosive diagrams. FOR FREE.
    * If software is included, manufacturer must state in packaging how long upgrades and updates will be provided.
    * If software is included, it must be user replaceable. Even on an appliance, the manufacturer must provide instructions (e.g. EEPROM, replaceable chip, dongle which shows that software was user modified -> important for safety)
    * Repairability
    * More stuff...
And every half year this rules will be re-evaluated and will show it with traffic signal colors {green, yellow, red}. Therefore it will adopt constantly and not a fixed final law. The taxes for red signals will pay for this constant re-evaluation. So you can still buy an iPhone but it will show some green parts and a lot of red. And an Android will show similar things. While a ThinkPad will probably show a lot of green but one big fat red for the soldered RAM. It also doesn't state that a largely red product is from an "evil" manufacturer, maybe it is a small business shipping a small batch for a specific customer base. While, when you buy a product which is green in all areas, you probably made a long term investment.

PS: I doesn't necessarily need to rise prices, which politicians often do because it is "easy". Maybe replace the FAT or parts of it.

Re: India follows EU's example in requiring USB-C charging for smart devices

#27

The sad part is that governments want standards but won't fund SIGs or FOSS projects which their digital infra runs on....

Why the whataboutism? Just cheer the progress.

Mandating standards by laws isn't progress. It holds the future back. This and the EU will be looked back on as a disastrous piece of legislation in the future. It's amazing how nearsighted these governments are being.

Standards are universally created by industry organically, not created by governments.

Re: India follows EU's example in requiring USB-C charging for smart devices

#28
post #8

I'm sure I'm not the first person to raise this concern but when tech improves to the point where there's a better option to USB C (or USB C is holding back other advances), are we going to have to wait for legislation to catch up before we can adopt it?

Why would that be a problem at all? If a significant advance in charging connectors is made, they can simply amend the law.

These laws don't say you can't make better chargers, they say if you make a mass produced device from the provided categories and it's going to charge by cable you will need to make sure that it has at least one USB-C charging port.

Besides, this is only in EU(and India now). Sure, there's a Brussels effect but as you can see even with iPhone the companies can have multiple versions of a product. US iPhones don't have physical SIM cards anymore, the other have it. So if it happens that Apple invents significantly better charging port for the iPhone, they can sell those everywhere else in the world and EU can revisit the laws if there's an interest.

Re: India follows EU's example in requiring USB-C charging for smart devices

#29
post #8

I'm sure I'm not the first person to raise this concern but when tech improves to the point where there's a better option to USB C (or USB C is holding back other advances), are we going to have to wait for legislation to catch up before we can adopt it?

Yes although two charge ports doesn't sound impossible and/or especially bad to me. Especially if the port is a brand new standard you'll never be able to borrow a charge cable for from a friend. Would be interested to know how much multiple charge ports affect price/complexity.

Two charging ports do not work on a phone, space is tight in there already.

>Especially if the port is a brand new standard you'll never be able to borrow a charge cable for from a friend.

The solution to that are adapters.

Re: India follows EU's example in requiring USB-C charging for smart devices

#30

I have a gaming laptop, that won't work with USB C, right? EDIT: looks like that's not going to change

If it pulls more than 240W from the wall it can use USB-C PD, though common chargers only go up to (or just a bit over) 100W.

My charger uses 180W for my personal laptop. My office laptop already has USB C and pulls 65W.
Post reply on HN