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The Untold Story Behind Saudi Arabia’s U.S. Treasury Holdings

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Re: The Untold Story Behind Saudi Arabia’s U.S. Treasury Holdings

#51

Post by travmatt »

s_q_b wrote: post #16
dforrestwilson1 wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Perhaps we should be demanding heads on pikes. This has very real implications for Hillary Clinton's election chances as well. The Clintons have been supporters of the Saudis for some time now and have accepted Saudi government money through the Clinton Foundation. https://www.clintonfoundation.org/contributors?category=%241... http://www.motherjones.com/politics/2015/05/hillary-clinton-... There is no reason the U.S…

Swinging the election toward a hawkish demagogue with no knowledge of foreign policy does not seem like a desirable outcome for the United States either. It's worth noting that for now the Saudis still retain a bit of leverage. They could potentially start a kamikaze run on the dollar. They are our largest regional ally, and in very close proximity to Israel. We have very little knowledge of their nuclear program. Fi…

"It's worth noting that for now the Saudis still retain a bit of leverage. They could potentially start a kamikaze run on the dollar. "

Do you have an idea of whether their increased production has affected the fracking production in the US? Would they, in the long-term, have success in making the US more dependent again?

"They are our largest regional ally, and in very close proximity to Israel... Finally, they're a vital partner in the ongoing war with Russia and its proxies (Iran et al.)"

As I understand it, the Saudi Royal family derives part of its legitimacy through the backing of the religious leaders of their country, and the Sunni world at large - but many of the Saudi family itself are actually more progressive than the conservative country. Is there any chance that they want to or could push back against the Wahhabist ideology that seems to spout from the gulf peninsula?

" We have very little knowledge of their nuclear program"

How is that possible? It'd seem as though their supplies of nuclear weapons are precisely the types that we want to be aware of at all times?

"Also, I cannot begin to fathom what would happen if a "Christian" nation invaded the keeper of Mecca and Medina...

I never thought I'd say this, but perhaps some secrets are better left untold."

When the cube was seized in 1979 and the Muslim world thought the US was to blame, we got the glimpses of what reactions could be. We'd truly see the Middle East in flames.

Re: The Untold Story Behind Saudi Arabia’s U.S. Treasury Holdings

#52

Post by Shivetya »

dforrestwilson1 wrote: post #13
s_q_b wrote: post #9

You can see from their reported figures that their U.S. treasury holdings are far too low for a sensible national portfolio. It's a pretty glaring hole, and you know that the money is going somewhere off the balance sheets. The question has always been how much U.S. debt exactly the Saudi's hold. This is an interesting historical anecdote, but it doesn't provide any information about the size of the debt, other than…

Perhaps we should be demanding heads on pikes. This has very real implications for Hillary Clinton's election chances as well. The Clintons have been supporters of the Saudis for some time now and have accepted Saudi government money through the Clinton Foundation. https://www.clintonfoundation.org/contributors?category=%241... http://www.motherjones.com/politics/2015/05/hillary-clinton-... There is no reason the U.S…

I would prefer that instead of piking more heads we, the US, just bugger off. I have no issue with a strong military, I have a big concern with protecting countries or having bases in countries that have more than sufficient GDP to protect themselves.

For the time being availability of oil for all nations through the Gulf states is as simple as keeping a US CV fleet or two in the area. It benefits all nations outside the region and doesn't require propping up repressive regimes to accomplish.

Re: The Untold Story Behind Saudi Arabia’s U.S. Treasury Holdings

#53

Post by FrojoS »

I have a stupid question that is a bit more general than the Saudi case. What's the advantage of selling oil and the using the dollars to buy treasuries or other conservative investment assets? Wouldn't it make much more sense for a country like Saudi Arabia to limit their oil production and finance their deficit of the sales directly instead of using royalties? This assumes that the value of oil will rather rise over time . In addition, for a producer as large as the Saudi's, this strategy should even raise oil prices.

Re: The Untold Story Behind Saudi Arabia’s U.S. Treasury Holdings

#54

Post by pjc50 »

s_q_b wrote: post #16
dforrestwilson1 wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Perhaps we should be demanding heads on pikes. This has very real implications for Hillary Clinton's election chances as well. The Clintons have been supporters of the Saudis for some time now and have accepted Saudi government money through the Clinton Foundation. https://www.clintonfoundation.org/contributors?category=%241... http://www.motherjones.com/politics/2015/05/hillary-clinton-... There is no reason the U.S…

Swinging the election toward a hawkish demagogue with no knowledge of foreign policy does not seem like a desirable outcome for the United States either. It's worth noting that for now the Saudis still retain a bit of leverage. They could potentially start a kamikaze run on the dollar. They are our largest regional ally, and in very close proximity to Israel. We have very little knowledge of their nuclear program. Fi…

Obviously invading KSA would be a total disaster. Even embargoing the place could have chaotic results beyond the massive oil price spike. Not to mention the strategic complications of the US relying on bases there.

I find it interesting that you've gone straight for "war with Russia" without bothering with "cold". I really don't like this second cold war because at least the first one was obvious to everyone and publicly discussed. The new one is conducted just like the old one through proxy countries which the players are prepared to burn down to deny them to the enemy, but if the chaos spreads to Turkey then that will be the end of the EU as everyone rolls out the barbed wire and machine guns to stop the tens of millions of potential refugees.

Re: The Untold Story Behind Saudi Arabia’s U.S. Treasury Holdings

#55

Post by pjc50 »

Shivetya wrote: post #52
dforrestwilson1 wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Perhaps we should be demanding heads on pikes. This has very real implications for Hillary Clinton's election chances as well. The Clintons have been supporters of the Saudis for some time now and have accepted Saudi government money through the Clinton Foundation. https://www.clintonfoundation.org/contributors?category=%241... http://www.motherjones.com/politics/2015/05/hillary-clinton-... There is no reason the U.S…

I would prefer that instead of piking more heads we, the US, just bugger off. I have no issue with a strong military, I have a big concern with protecting countries or having bases in countries that have more than sufficient GDP to protect themselves. For the time being availability of oil for all nations through the Gulf states is as simple as keeping a US CV fleet or two in the area. It benefits all nations outside…

having bases in countries that have more than sufficient GDP to protect themselves

As in Germany, the bases aren't there for the US to protect that country but the other way round: to ensure that country remains US-aligned.

Re: The Untold Story Behind Saudi Arabia’s U.S. Treasury Holdings

#56

Post by api »

advertising wrote: post #36

There's a book called confessions of an economic hit man - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Confessions_of_an_Economic_Hit... Essentially U.S. helps impoverished nations with infrastructure and other aid, but saddles them with debt in order to control them politically or otherwise. The interesting part was when it came to Saudi Arabia, which had so much money it didn't need to take on debt to develop their infrastructur…

The student debt indenture system is the same thing in the microcosm.

Re: The Untold Story Behind Saudi Arabia’s U.S. Treasury Holdings

#57

Post by lmm »

rwmj wrote: post #24
aedron wrote: post #17

The massive issuance of U.S. Dollar debt to Saudi Arabia, as a result of the deal mentioned in the OP, coincided perfectly with the abolition of the gold standard (the dollar being linked to physical gold reserves) [1]. So right from the start, the U.S. was purchasing oil with pieces of paper with no guaranteed value of any sort. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nixon_shock

I'd rather have fiat currency than gold, because that would save me the time and hassle of selling the gold and getting something I can actually spend.

For an individual that makes sense. For a nation the cost/hassle of selling gold is comparatively low, and the risk of the fiat backer's interests being averse to one's own is much higher.

Re: The Untold Story Behind Saudi Arabia’s U.S. Treasury Holdings

#58

Post by arethuza »

MOARDONGZPLZ wrote: post #50
zeeshanm wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There is a new edition of the book mentioned above if anyone's interested: "The New Confessions of an Economic Hit Man."

Thanks for the heads up. I read the original in college and it was very interesting, although I thought it was a bit embellished. http://www.amazon.com/New-Confessions-Economic-Hit-Man/dp/16...

I read it a good few years back and found it interesting although I was slightly skeptical about to what degree the conspiracies described existed outside of the author's head.

However, being older and somewhat more cynical (particularly after binge reading about the UK involvement in the Iraq and Afghan Wars) I do wonder if I should read this again - are there any materials out there that support his claims?

Re: The Untold Story Behind Saudi Arabia’s U.S. Treasury Holdings

#59

Post by wahsd »

knodi123 wrote: post #21
wahsd wrote: post #19

We really should simply cancel all debt and confiscate all assets owned by Saudi Arabia and any other muslim country as consequence for 9/11 and all the other terrorist attacks against the west hat muslims are organizing, supporting, and funding in order to undermine, fracture, and weaken the west with the help of self-loathing and self-destructive liberals. What are they going to do about it. Will Europeans all the…

> muslims are voluntarily part of a vile organization founded by vile savages I was on board with your rant until this point, but I refuse to wave a pitchfork around and scream for blood with someone who doesn't even own a thesaurus.

What, because I reinforced the fact that islam is a vile organization founded by vile savages? Are you so feeble minded that you dismiss reality simply because a concept is repeated. Islam was founded by people who slaughtered people who surrendered, and then mass raped their wives in the blood soaked soil and then enslaved them. What other word does your thesaurus suggest could be used besides vile?

Islam is a cancer on all of humanity. It constantly and persistently proves it, yet for some reason the morons cannot see the blatant reality right in front of their faces that will cut off their head the second they gain control. Fools think that muslims are innocuous because they know them personally as I have known them all my life, but reality is that islam is just like a cancer or virus, if you have a few abnormal cells or even early stage cancerous cells, you can avert the inevitable, but you will rue the day you do a Steve Jobs and try to meditate and juice away your highly treatable cancer until it is too late.

Islam is an infection on all of humanity, all other cultures, all other religions, all other humans. Once muslim is fine, a few muslims can't affect much; but that's why they continuously and insatiably reproduce and infiltrate and undermine and will never and relentlessly hammer away until they have dominated. It is precisely and exactly how Islam grew and spread throughout the middle east and it is precisely how they will dominate Europe after centuries of blood, sweat, and tears spilled to keep the caner at bay.

You are supporting the cancer that will eat away at every single thing you claim to believe in. There will be not stopping it, it is not just a cute little mole that give you character, it is a cancer that is eating away at you and will only lead to one thing. It is precisely like a virus, precisely a trojan horse.

Re: The Untold Story Behind Saudi Arabia’s U.S. Treasury Holdings

#60

Post by akamaka »

arethuza wrote: post #58
MOARDONGZPLZ wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thanks for the heads up. I read the original in college and it was very interesting, although I thought it was a bit embellished. http://www.amazon.com/New-Confessions-Economic-Hit-Man/dp/16...

I read it a good few years back and found it interesting although I was slightly skeptical about to what degree the conspiracies described existed outside of the author's head. However, being older and somewhat more cynical (particularly after binge reading about the UK involvement in the Iraq and Afghan Wars) I do wonder if I should read this again - are there any materials out there that support his claims?

I also read the book, and what he describes is pretty much classic, straightforward bribery of foreign officials. There's a lot of embellishment by the author for the sake of hinting at broader conspiracies he didn't personally witness, and to aggrandize his own role in the matter.
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