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Volkswagen launches its first all-electric SUV, the ID.4

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Re: Volkswagen launches its first all-electric SUV, the ID.4

#451

Post by 0_____0 »

grecy wrote: post #310
Koshkin wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, California is one of the very few places on Earth where you can do that.

I lived in the Yukon, Canada for 4 years, and rode my bike 365 days a year. Yes, even in -40 and beyond temperatures I rode. In fact, Whitehorse has the highest rate of bike ridership in Canada!

Wow that's pretty amazing. I'm a Californian in Boston and I managed to ride when it was about 0F out and I thought that was a bit much. How do you dress for such a venture? I find that either I'm freezing cold when starting off until I get warm through exertion, or I'm comfortable starting off and am sweltering by the time I get where I'm going.

Re: Volkswagen launches its first all-electric SUV, the ID.4

#452

Post by rudedogg »

hourislate wrote: post #397
jacquesm wrote: post #284

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> like all the old farts buying Harley's and pretending they are some kind of bikers...shame they destroyed the brand Actually, they kept the brand alive by buying the product. Without those people they'd have died long ago.

>Actually, they kept the brand alive by buying the product. >Without those people they'd have died long ago. I disagree, the Company was founded in 1903 and was did well into the 90's and then the 50 plus crowd decided to be some kind of poser biker gang type and destroyed the brand. Not very different than what happened to the Corvette and all the 6o plus folks buying them the last 20 years.

What did these people do to the brand image? I guess I don't understand what it was like before this happened.

Re: Volkswagen launches its first all-electric SUV, the ID.4

#453

Post by 0_____0 »

usaphp wrote: post #218
kajecounterhack wrote: post #122

Earlier quoted context omitted.

New prices are quite prohibitive but the state of things actually isn't the worst for used EVs if you can stomach low range. My family does a two-car approach: 1. Hybrid SUV for actually getting places and moving things 2. ~$4k a used 2013 Smart car. ~45 mile range is good enough for short commute, grocery runs, etc. Charge at home or at work (we have the uncommon situation of no charging at home since we live in a c…

$4k for a 2013 smart? You got some amazing deal, they usually sell for twice that amount. Hard to find any decent one for less than $7-8k

I think the difference with cars is that manufacturers make many more of them. Building bikes is still a very manual process with a lot of human touch, but waaaaay more options available. You see something similar with mountain bikes vs. dirtbikes. How can I get a 300lb machine with full suspension and an entire combustion engine for $3k and an FS MTB, with a fraction of the parts costs the same or more? Well, Honda probably make 50k CRF250s a year or something, and Norco make maybe 1/20th the number for any particular product line?

Re: Volkswagen launches its first all-electric SUV, the ID.4

#454

Post by imwillofficial »

Ma8ee wrote: post #440
aaronbrethorst wrote: post #295

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sounds kind of like Leica to me: orthodontists running around Africa or Asia pretending to be Steve McCurry with $11,000 'Safari' cameras destroyed the brand for me. Yeah, sure, the company is still technically alive, but at what cost? (and lest you think I'm joking: https://www.dpreview.com/news/9864312105/leica-releases-limi... )

Are the cameras not good anymore? Or is it that the “wrong people“ are using their products that bothers you? If it is the latter, then you are just trying to buy an identity through brands, and you are as much part of the problem.

Leica glass is still top notch. GP is just making some weird status thing out of it.

Re: Volkswagen launches its first all-electric SUV, the ID.4

#455

Post by imwillofficial »

hourislate wrote: post #397
jacquesm wrote: post #284

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> like all the old farts buying Harley's and pretending they are some kind of bikers...shame they destroyed the brand Actually, they kept the brand alive by buying the product. Without those people they'd have died long ago.

>Actually, they kept the brand alive by buying the product. >Without those people they'd have died long ago. I disagree, the Company was founded in 1903 and was did well into the 90's and then the 50 plus crowd decided to be some kind of poser biker gang type and destroyed the brand. Not very different than what happened to the Corvette and all the 6o plus folks buying them the last 20 years.

Wrong, the brand hung on and is dying out with boomers. Everyone knows that the younger kids get crotch rockets. It wasn’t the hold people that ruined the brand, it was the brand marketing to Boomers for shortsighted gains. Harleys are for Boomers. Harley made sure that was the message. Now they pay for it.

Re: Volkswagen launches its first all-electric SUV, the ID.4

#456

Post by sjg007 »

aaronbrethorst wrote: post #235
s0rce wrote: post #115

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Could most of those be base model work trucks with the average price heavily skewed by the luxury pickup market.

According to AutoWeek, who I expect knows of what it speaks, "The most popular model [of the Ford F-150] is the SuperCrew XLT with the 302A package...That pickup, upgraded to 4X4 and the 6.5 foot bed, comes out to $50,020." https://www.autoweek.com/news/trucks/a33584476/this-is-how-y...

Need to seat 4 and the dog plus tow the boat or camper. Also the bed is good for Home Depot runs.

Re: Volkswagen launches its first all-electric SUV, the ID.4

#457

Post by mikestew »

bananabreakfast wrote: post #222
mikestew wrote: post #193

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Oh, oh, I can answer this, given ownership of a ten year old Leaf ($35K) and a fifteen year old Scion xB/rebadged Toyota Echo ($20K): the $20K car is still going to win in TCO. Because the Leaf already starts out $15K in the hole. That's a lot of oil and coolant changes. That's a lot of brake pads. And those are pretty much the three things an ICE needs done versus BEV. After 100K miles, the Scion needed a $1500 clut…

You left out the very important and difference making cost of gasoline. Which over 10 years of driving would more than make up the difference in cost.

We’ve put 50K miles on our Leaf. Assuming 35mpg like our Scion xB, and that’s about $5K worth of gas. Assuming electricity to be free, it still doesn’t make up the difference. Of course the savings go up the more you drive, but how many miles are you going to put on a car that can only go 100 miles at a time on its best day?

Re: Volkswagen launches its first all-electric SUV, the ID.4

#458

Post by ajross »

argonaut wrote: post #404
ajross wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Actually the market for new sub-$20k vehicles is quite small. Most people with budget concerns buy used. The median new passenger vehicle is something like a $40k minivan or pickup. So these EVs really aren't very far off the mark financially.

The "small" market for new sub-$20k vehicles includes: the Toyota Corolla, Hyundai Elantra, Mazda 3, Nissan Sentra, Hyundai Kona, and Kia Soul, depending on options. Sometimes you can get a new base Civic for just under $20k. All of these are very popular cars. Basically the entire subcompact car or crossover segments (non-luxury), and most of the compact car segment (depending on options).

Of that list, only the Soul has a starting MSRP under $20k I believe, the others all have $20k as a floor. And I'm not saying that no one buys those cars, just that the market isn't large and that most new cars are significantly more expensive. This link puts the average (I couldn't find a median) at $41k, for example: https://www.usatoday.com/story/money/cars/2021/01/07/new-car...

So a bunch of EV's sitting 20-30% above that level aren't being priced out of the range of popular cars. They're very feasible purchases for most buyers.

Re: Volkswagen launches its first all-electric SUV, the ID.4

#459

Post by hourislate »

rudedogg wrote: post #452
hourislate wrote: post #397

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Actually, they kept the brand alive by buying the product. >Without those people they'd have died long ago. I disagree, the Company was founded in 1903 and was did well into the 90's and then the 50 plus crowd decided to be some kind of poser biker gang type and destroyed the brand. Not very different than what happened to the Corvette and all the 6o plus folks buying them the last 20 years.

What did these people do to the brand image? I guess I don't understand what it was like before this happened.

Harley's were synonymous with Motorcycle Gangs (Ex: Hells Angels, etc) or with young cool men (18+).

All of a sudden in the 90's a lot of these 40-60 year olds started to try and recapture their youth or that coolness they never had. They started buying Harley's and dressing in Leather and making these ridiculous club patches and driving around revving their motorcycles everywhere. It was so cringe that you actually felt ashamed for them.

Here is a good clip from South Park that kind of sums it all up.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xGyKBFCd_u4

Re: Volkswagen launches its first all-electric SUV, the ID.4

#460

Post by wr1472 »

rsync wrote: post #142

Is it their electric car or is it their car, electric ? I don't want your electric car. I don't want your e-initiative i-mobile green-tech tron-car. I want one of your actual cars, just electric . I don't want an ID.4 - I just want a Passat. I don't want the polestar e-initiative i-concept - I just want a V90 wagon. I don't want a future space truck, I just want a Silverado - but electric. God. Dammit.

"I don't want a new-fangled 'automobile', I want a horse with wheels god damnit!" - probably someone to Henry Ford in 1905.
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