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EU–INC – A new pan-European legal entity

eu-inc.org

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Re: EU–INC – A new pan-European legal entity

#431

Post by galangalalgol »

wolvoleo wrote: post #384
torginus wrote: post #376

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is this a true problem in EU (or indeed anywhere)? I don't think starting a company is the bottleneck, it's mostly the inordinate amount of regulations one has to comply with, as well as the strenuous laws around letting workers go, while making people work as contractors being also frowned upon. I'm not sure how any one these is going to change.

Those things are as designed. This is good. We don't want "at-will" employment like in the US. We want to have rights as employees. We want to have social welfare. We want our free healthcare. It's not a bug it's a feature. We don't want an American-style society. Current developments should be enough reason to understand why (and the understanding that Trump's backers are part of a huge group of people on the low si…

Free healthcare and social welfare I'm in agreement on. But why does at will employment need to conflict with that? The problems of wage values, food and shelter, and healthcare can be handled completely independently of employment. If someone feels it is too easy to do nothing without requiring employment to gain some of those benefits, you can have the government as an employer of last resort. But making it easy for anyone and everyone to start and maintain a business is a societal good. We are asking why doesn't a person have guaranteed employment, when we should ask why do they need it. If a person was let go and could with empty pockets be assured of food shelter and healthcare, and also be able to start their own company on the way home from being let go, that is the society I'd want to live in.

Re: EU–INC – A new pan-European legal entity

#433

Post by Imustaskforhelp »

Wow, I was writing about something like having an easy way to create EU legal entity (all be it from India) on a different thread.

I hope this succeeds and also hopefully allows easy creation of EU company from outside EU as well.

Atleast personally I am interested in creating a EU company which holds Indian company instead of vice versa because as I said on other comments, I think I deeply align with EU privacy laws & usually most of EU in general.

Currently someone messaged on my other comment and the best way which is estonia would cost me around 1500 euros or more which is just a no go for me personally right now.

I have only read it from top of the page but if I may ask, can someone tell if does this benefit my use case?

Re: EU–INC – A new pan-European legal entity

#434

Post by alibarber »

mmunj wrote: post #225
krisknez wrote: post #202

I’m from Croatia, and starting and running a company here is expensive. Estonia makes it much easier, so you might think: why not open a company in Estonia? But here is a problem: If your clients are in Croatia and you have a Croatian company, you don’t have to charge VAT if you earn under 60k per year. But if your company is in Estonia, you are required to charge VAT even if you earn under 60k.

>But if your company is in Estonia, you are required to charge VAT even if you earn under 60k. Is this not simply because companies in Estonia enter VAT at 40k per year (rather than 60k)? (and IIRC Croatia was also at 40k a year ago, now is at 60k with some politicians trying to raise the entry to 100k)

If the clients are cross border - there is no threshold, you have to charge the VAT rate of the country in which they are located from the start.

Re: EU–INC – A new pan-European legal entity

#436

Post by tcldr »

alibarber wrote: post #382

This is a great initiative that I've been following, but the stumbling block is still 'local taxes [and employment]' - that's still 27 different tax codes to deal with, submitting returns to in 27 different languages. Even now with cross-border selling, there are 27 different VAT codes to follow when transacting within Europe. Sure, you can report and actually settle it to a single national authority (and then that n…

Agreed. If the CFC (controlled foreign corporation) rules still apply for founders in EU-member states, it will fail.

I’m hoping they can be creative and find a way to distribute revenues to member states in a way that works for everyone.

For employment taxes, one way could be to tax EU-inc employees as if self-employed in their personal tax domicile.

Re: EU–INC – A new pan-European legal entity

#437

Post by ExoticPearTree »

wolvoleo wrote: post #384
torginus wrote: post #376

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is this a true problem in EU (or indeed anywhere)? I don't think starting a company is the bottleneck, it's mostly the inordinate amount of regulations one has to comply with, as well as the strenuous laws around letting workers go, while making people work as contractors being also frowned upon. I'm not sure how any one these is going to change.

Those things are as designed. This is good. We don't want "at-will" employment like in the US. We want to have rights as employees. We want to have social welfare. We want our free healthcare. It's not a bug it's a feature. We don't want an American-style society. Current developments should be enough reason to understand why (and the understanding that Trump's backers are part of a huge group of people on the low si…

> We don't want "at-will" employment like in the US.

Only lazy people want to be employed for life somewhere. All the benefits, no responsibility.

Re: EU–INC – A new pan-European legal entity

#438

Post by friendzis »

alibarber wrote: post #387
niemandhier wrote: post #359

Earlier quoted context omitted.

At least in Germany, this is not correct. You do not have to pay that unless: You earned more than €100,000 this year or more than €25,000 last year.

But there is no threshold for cross-border selling in the EU. Fine if you're selling widgets at a market in Germany - but if you sell software abroad, make sure you're following [each] one of the 27 VAT codes correctly. (From what I understand - would love this to be wrong)

> Fine if you're selling widgets at a market in Germany - but if you sell software abroad, make sure you're following [each] one of the 27 VAT codes correctly.

Yes.

> But there is no threshold for cross-border selling in the EU.

Kinda, but misinterprets the VAT itself.

Basically, VAT is paid at the point of sale and local thresholds apply.

Re: EU–INC – A new pan-European legal entity

#439

Post by seec »

weslleyskah wrote: post #411
seec wrote: post #370

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

This is the same as saying that Russians are wild boars who only care about vodka, stupid wars, money and women. Source: Dostoyevsky

Stereotypes exist for a reason. It would be stupid to argue that every single Russian is exactly like that. But at the same time you'll find those traits exhibited in a lot of Russians at various levels of seriousness.

Being bigoted is also pretending that tribes/cultures do not share patterns and behavior. Individuals are unique, but they exist as part of a group. When you talk about the group, you necessarily need to make shortcuts and synthesize.

I'm pretty sure that when you talk about dogs, you'll attribute specific behaviors to specific races. But now it is not politically correct to think humans are the same, even though it is scientifically provable.

Re: EU–INC – A new pan-European legal entity

#440

Post by bluecalm »

embedding-shape wrote: post #383
bluecalm wrote: post #336

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>>Having a startup in the US is a huge mess due to all the states and taxes, In EU you will need to deal with VAT basically from day one (10k EUR of revenue). In US you will not deal with it until you can afford it as thresholds are very generous.

If dealing with VAT is a large problem for your business today, running a business might just not be for you, it's very trivial today to get it right and there are even platforms who basically does all the "hard" work for you. But even without those 3rd party solutions, I think the complexity is vastly oversold, it's relatively easy to get right compared to other regulations. Maybe I'm just EU-damaged already though,…

>>If dealing with VAT is a large problem for your business today

It's not a problem for me today. It was a big problem when I had no revenue, needed to do all the paperwork, meet ridiculous local accounting requirements connected to selling software in a different currency than my local one, write code, setup licensing, shipping the software to the clients etc.

It was a major source of stress and sleepless nights for me.

>>But even without those 3rd party solutions, I think the complexity is vastly oversold, it's relatively easy to get right compared to other regulations. Maybe I'm just EU-damaged already though, YMMV.

It's easy when you have done it once and know the process. It's not so easy when you need to understand if your product meets a definition of an electronic service or something else, when accountants you are meeting don't know how to setup VAT-MOSS thing because it's still rare or when you need to add your tax authority about something and their reply is that they don't know so you need to write an official inquire (that requires a lawyer) so you can get your answer in a few months.

When I was setting a new company in another country it was easier for me because I already knew how the process work and I could hire a competent accountant before the new company had any revenue. It wasn't so simple when I had 0 capital and just wanted to ship software to see if people want to buy it.

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