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Paradise Papers: New leak from offshore finance firm

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Re: Paradise Papers: New leak from offshore finance firm

#411

Post by nickpp »

wfo wrote: post #376
nickpp wrote: post #345

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That is the choice of giving up my money, or dying - during a robbery. I am talking about the choice I have in any free marked: where to spend my money and what to get in exchange. I have none of that when it comes to over half of my revenue: my taxes.

You have a huge amount of choice in your taxes; you can vote, run for office, and advocate for political positions. You have zero choice in your economic situation (if you are 99% of people) since most financial choices are made for you by large companies that you have zero stake in or control over. Is there a difference between someone pointing a gun at your head and saying 'your money or your life' and a company th…

Have you voted? How much did your vote count? Did you run for office? How much change did you manage to bring?

In a company you can also buy shares, vote at board meeting or get a job in and change it from the inside.

But that is not the freedom of choice I am talking about. That is a fake choice since it is too difficult, requiring you to change your entire life.

What I am talking about is the simple choice of free market: choosing who to give your money and for what services.

I do not intend to give up the government services, I just want to be able to transparently select the provider and not have to buy them in bulk, bundled together.

Re: Paradise Papers: New leak from offshore finance firm

#412

Post by pyrale »

joelrunyon wrote: post #76
pyrale wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It's the wrong angle. One should not look at corporations as the moral saviours. [...] Rather, it is the governments of the world we should be going at if we want this behaviour to change. Let us pretend that corporations have no influence over laws and governments, and merely play a game they had no hand in designing.

So the corporation is still the symptom. What we should be doing is insulating the government from outside influence.

Let us try something impossible in order to avoid questioning our faith in corporations.

In reality, it's impossible to build a thriving society on the expectation that no one should act morally. We should definitely hold our corporations accountable for being dodgy and exploit rather than report perceived problems.

Re: Paradise Papers: New leak from offshore finance firm

#413

Post by isostatic »

nickpp wrote: post #409
isostatic wrote: post #378

Earlier quoted context omitted.

move to a country/region with no taxes. If you want the benefits of a country that has decided to charge people to live there, then you have to pay - same if you want the benefits of membership of a club.

I don’t know of any place without taxes, do you? Through force, governments carved up the planet and each became a local monopoly in its own region. Totally unlike a club, where you have the benefit of choice. Free market vs monopoly, you know.

Move to Antarctica. I doubt anyone will notice. Live on a boat in the ocean.

Move to a Caribbean island like Anguilla or Cayman, or the gulf like Kuwait or Dubai or Qatar

Hong Kong, Syria, Paraguay have low tax too

Re: Paradise Papers: New leak from offshore finance firm

#414

Post by isostatic »

avar wrote: post #199

A publication using "the 1%" in the context of "the global elite" means what exactly? A salary slightly north of $30k/yr lands you in the global elite club of the 1%.

Surely your net wort h would make more sense to see how wealthy you are, the top 1% of wealthy people have a wealth of about $900k upwards. A wealth of $3k would put you in the top half.

Re: Paradise Papers: New leak from offshore finance firm

#415

Post by nickpp »

isostatic wrote: post #413
nickpp wrote: post #409

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don’t know of any place without taxes, do you? Through force, governments carved up the planet and each became a local monopoly in its own region. Totally unlike a club, where you have the benefit of choice. Free market vs monopoly, you know.

Move to Antarctica. I doubt anyone will notice. Live on a boat in the ocean. Move to a Caribbean island like Anguilla or Cayman, or the gulf like Kuwait or Dubai or Qatar Hong Kong, Syria, Paraguay have low tax too

All those places have taxes. Low taxes, but they have them.

What you don't seem to understand is that I am not arguing against taxes themselves. Or even high taxes. Of course I would pay lots of money to partake in civilized society and its services.

What I want is free market competition for how my taxes are spent and those services received. Because with the current monopoly the government has no reason to improve in any way and instead it takes my taxes and uses them as they see fit - mostly to ensure their reelection.

It takes tremendous amounts of money and gives me horrid services. And they have the gall to tell me that this is the only way and I don't need or deserve any other choice! That, in my book, is stealing.

Imagine please that there was a smartphone tax. You'd pay a certain amount a year and you'd get a single, government issued smartphone. Compare that with the current free-market solution. Which one is better, which one would you prefer?

Now apply that thinking to all other government services. That is my whole point.

Re: Paradise Papers: New leak from offshore finance firm

#416

Post by infinite8s »

eli_gottlieb wrote: post #343
nodesocket wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It's a tax cut for billionaires bought and paid for by the GOP donor class I am a small business owner setup as a LLC single member company and the new cap will be a positive for me. It will reduce my tax burden allowing me to buy more software from companies, hire, expand, increase advertising spending, etc. I am a very real case, and there are lots of other small business owners like me who are certainly not bill…

Maybe, but by the way, if you live in a state that provides state services using state taxes, your state-and-local taxes will no longer be deductible. So the GOP bill comes off as a "fuck you" to a lot of us, since they kinda want to double-tax us for which state we live in.

Coincidentally those states often vote blue.

Re: Paradise Papers: New leak from offshore finance firm

#417

Post by mooreds »

danharaj wrote: post #96
joelrunyon wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So the corporation is still the symptom. What we should be doing is insulating the government from outside influence.

A government insulated from outside influence no longer governs.

Yes. I would call that the textbook definition of tyranny.

For all the problems special interest lobbying brings, it's far better than the alternative.

Re: Paradise Papers: New leak from offshore finance firm

#418

Post by Clubber »

mindcrime wrote: post #394
Clubber wrote: post #179

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No one likes paying taxes but calling it theft is intellectually dishonest and hyperbolic that attempts to paint taxation as immoral for people who like to think emotionally rather than rationally. I mean you happily use the services that taxes provide. Police, the legal system, roads, schools, libraries, anything created using the legal system, roads, schools or libraries, fuel exploration subsidies, research, etc.…

No one likes paying taxes but calling it theft is intellectually dishonest No, calling it anything but theft is "intellectually dishonest". I mean you happily use the services that taxes provide. Police, the legal system, roads, schools, libraries, anything created using the legal system, roads, schools or libraries, fuel exploration subsidies, research, etc. No, I don't happily use any of those things. I grudgingly…

It's part of the citizenship deal. Renounce your citizenship or make less than $10K a year. Pretty simple. By retaining your citizenship and just complaining about it, you are accepting the deal. The document about taxes is the constitution. It's an opt-out agreement. You got a free ride up until 18, and can opt out anytime you wish.

Article I, Section 8, Clause 1: The Congress shall have Power to lay and collect Taxes, Duties, Imposts and Excises, to pay the Debts and provide for the common Defence and general Welfare of the United States; but all Duties, Imposts and Excises shall be uniform throughout the United States.

Re: Paradise Papers: New leak from offshore finance firm

#419

Post by nickthemagicman »

icelancer wrote: post #219
nickthemagicman wrote: post #89

My parents always taught me to be honest and care about those around you. The older I got the more I realized that was mal-adaptive behavior in capitalistic society. The real goal of capitalism is exploit or be exploited.

> The real goal of capitalism is exploit or be exploited. The real goal of capitalism is to increase the amount of capital available. This fundamentally is not possible via exploitation alone. Capitalism - nor the economy - is not a zero-sum game. This type of simplistic thinking makes people dismiss real criticisms over the real-world implementation of American capitalism.

'The real goal of capitalism is to increase the amount of capital available. This fundamentally is not possible via exploitation alone.'

The south built an entire economy based on 'exploitation alone' in the early 1800's....

You need to qualify your statement: 'The real goal of capitalism is to increase the amount of capitalism available'. Available to who? humanity at large? Nope. Capitalists don't share their wealth. Capitalism increases capital for the people who control the capital. See every economic study made in the past ten years. The middle and working class exist to serve the capitalists aims. Slavery in a pretty package.

Re: Paradise Papers: New leak from offshore finance firm

#420

Post by chiefalchemist »

krapp wrote: post #381
chiefalchemist wrote: post #288

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But that's the beauty of the ruse isn't it? The Establishment (of both parties) has the masses believing Trump invented racism, sexism, income inequality, etc. That before Trump there were no such things. Trump is to blame for racism? That would be funny if it wasn't so ridiculous.

>The Establishment (of both parties) has the masses believing Trump invented racism, sexism, income inequality, etc. That before Trump there were no such things. Trump is to blame for racism? No, "the masses" have never believed that. Not even Trump's most rabid opponents believe that he invented racism, for instance, merely that he is more openly racist than his predecessors, and that he is more openly supported by…

So covert racism is okay? But open support is not?

The point is, the (white) "liberal" left has been sitting on it's hands, head in the sand, believing there has been sufficient progress. They did well to sell that (lie).

Now Trump shows up and suddening all hell is breaking lose? Nah. It's been there all along; swept under the rug. So rather than admit "yeah we underestimated the lack of progress" Trump & Co get the blame. This is fake history and it conpletely ignores real history.

Note: I'm not a Trump supporter. He's not my type of leadership. But we can't solve the right problems the right way if we are in complete denial about the root of those problems. The left's just-blame-Trump strategy is a great distraction. It's also, ultimately, a another step in the wrong direction.

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