When the tax bill comes to pay, the billionaire moves away.
Elon Musk moves to Texas
371–380 of 1001 posts
Re: Elon Musk moves to Texas
#372Earlier quoted context omitted.
At last count I've had 14 friends move out of California in the last 3 years. All of them middle class. The biggest reasons given are cost of living and quality of life and education for their kids.
We will be moving out of CA in the coming months. We are lifelong residents. We are leaving due to cost of living and especially quality of life for our children.
I would love to move out of CA in the coming months. My spouse is begging me to. If my job were to finally announce permanent, optional WFH for employees, I list my house for sale that day.
Same complaints: cost of living / taxes, quality of life, and kids' education.
The only thing keeping me here is my current job and clear opportunities for future [tech] jobs. If WFH became the norm, I'm out of here in 50 milliseconds. There are probably a lot of people like me.
Re: Elon Musk moves to Texas
#373I don't why this is news. Wealthy people move to low tax places all the time.
Re: Elon Musk moves to Texas
#374Earlier quoted context omitted.
California has a $54B deficit this year. It's been all over the news, including very left-wing sources like NY Times and Politico. The state _projected_ a surplus and was off by an entire order of magnitude into the red. The state has been campaigning to Congress all year for about $14B in bailout money.
> very left-wing sources like NY Times and Politico These are center-right sources by any reasonable standard
The NYT hasn't been center-right in years and Politico has always been firmly left.
I said very left-wing (as in firmly left-wing), not far-left.
Re: Elon Musk moves to Texas
#375California is actively looking for ways to extract more money from Elon. It likely posed an appreciable risk to his business ventures that CA at some point will try to tax unrecognized capital gains, which would require him to liquidate shares to pay the tax. Basically akin to a hostile government takeover. If CA were to aggressively pursue such a policy, they would likely go after anyone they perceived as fleeing ju…
You know that CA subsidized Tesla to the tune of billions of dollars right?
Re: Elon Musk moves to Texas
#376It's unfortunate that Elon is leaving California given that the state has really lifted him to the pedestal he is on - through the talent network (highly talented employees, VCs), and the progressive policies that CA built for clean technology (Solar, EVs, Energy Storage). That was paid for on the backs of the people. Funny how short his memory is. Elon is a talented man - I absolutely respect what he's done. However…
I think you're attributing too much credit to California.
> Highly talented employees
The vast majority of Tesla's "talented" employees came from out of state. Regardless of that, I don't understand the perspective that employment is an act of "taking from the state". Tesla pays above-market salaries. Isn't it, then, more accurate to view employment as Tesla giving back/helping to the community?
> Progressive policies that CA built for clean technology
I assume the policies you're referencing are the tax credits for solar installation and EV purchases. Aren't these credits independent of where the company is located? If so, Tesla would have been able to take advantage regardless of their location.
> Let's call this what it is - he doesn't want to pay a large tax bill for the success that he has had (hence selling all property in CA)
It seems reasonable to assume that his tax bill and California policies were both factors in his decision to move. What makes you so confident that the tax bill is the primary factor? Do you have some inside knowledge? If I were in his shoes, I'd be optimizing for Tesla's success, not my personal taxes. He's already wildly rich, and it's pretty clear to me that he's not doing this for the money.
Re: Elon Musk moves to Texas
#377Earlier quoted context omitted.
We will be moving out of CA in the coming months. We are lifelong residents. We are leaving due to cost of living and especially quality of life for our children.
This doesn't make any sense. Why is the quality of life poorer in California compared to Texas when California has: Better schools across all grades, better universities and better weather? Perhaps there are other factors? Do demographics play a role perchance? From Wikipedia: 1) According to 2018 US Census Bureau estimates, California's population was 59.5% White (36.6% Non-Hispanic White), 14.7% Asian, 13.8% Some O…
From your own numbers, Texas has >California has: Better schools across all grades
No, it doesn't. For example, USNWR ranks TX public schools #33 and CA #37:
https://www.usnews.com/news/best-states/rankings/education
More generally, public schools in many affordable parts of California are severely underfunded due to Proposition 13, while the statewide average is boosted by high-ranking schools in ultra-expensive cities like Palo Alto. Texas has less inequality between public schools and has earned international recognition for its Ten Percent Law:
Re: Elon Musk moves to Texas
#378Pretty interesting to see this move makes people so salty. There does seem to be a trend of people fleeing California, I dont know enough about the situation out there to comment on whether or not its valid. I suspect something must be going on for several high profile folks moving out. And before you bash Texas, its not perfect. But its pretty diverse, and it seems that folks with opposing viewpoints can still coexi…
My birth certificate says "Texas" across the top and people have been "fleeing California" to Texas for as long as I've been alive. There's nothing special about Musk; he just happens to be high-profile about it and managed to extract more from California before decamping to a "cheap" state than several of those who came before him. I disagree with your assessment that Texas has wide acceptance for opposing viewpoint…
I grew up in Tyler but have lived in Austin for 15 years. I don't mean to be argumentative but you seem to be comparing Small town Texas with "Big City" California. I've vacationed in smaller towns in California and the conservative nature of those areas remind me a lot of Tyler,Texas.
Re: Elon Musk moves to Texas
#379This article conveniently leaves the fact that he'll pay millions more in taxes in California due to TX not having any income tax until the very end. Also, his two biggest current projects (Giga Texas and Starship) are currently in Texas. This makes a lot of sense from a business standpoint and will just continue the flight from California. I suspect that once they have the Giga Texas built and delivering vehicles th…
My cynical take is that its an effort to re-branding effort in preparation for the launch of the Cybertruck and larger SUVs.
What self-respecting F-150 owner is going to buy a Tesla pick-up "Design in California".
And since he's a renter, rarely sleeps and has minimal possessions, how hard is it to "move"?
Re: Elon Musk moves to Texas
#380California is actively looking for ways to extract more money from Elon. It likely posed an appreciable risk to his business ventures that CA at some point will try to tax unrecognized capital gains, which would require him to liquidate shares to pay the tax. Basically akin to a hostile government takeover. If CA were to aggressively pursue such a policy, they would likely go after anyone they perceived as fleeing ju…
Many, many billionaires live, have lived, and thrive in CA - probably more than any place in the world. In fact, I'd guess that more billionaires have made their fortunes in CA than any other place. The grievance rhetoric has gone too far (and had awhile ago) when it's used by billionaires. There is also strong reactionary political rhetoric here, the premise that taxes on wealthy people are nearly criminal theft, an…
I am speaking for myself here, but the way I see it, the issue is more the way in which taxation is exercised than the taxation itself.
If I was in Elon's seat, I personally wouldn't mind paying 20 or 30% of my income in taxes. But vesting shares should not qualify as income. What should qualify as income is me selling those shares. In other words, If I am awarded 1B$ in shares that I have no plan on selling short term, I still have to liquidate 20-30% of those shares just to pay taxes, which may have a pretty high negative impact in term of voting rights.
Why could the taxation not occur when I am selling instead?