Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Why Europe Is Warning of Pax Americana's End

bloomberg.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

361–370 of 395 posts

Re: Why Europe Is Warning of Pax Americana's End

#361

Post by PerfectDlite »

droopyEyelids wrote: post #223
zzleeper wrote: post #110

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wait wait.. Russia plainly invaded two of its neighbors, and annexes part of them. Is that just "behaving badly" in your book?

First off, I think Russia is a corrupt kleptocracy. But think about it for just one second. Crimea contains Russia's _only_ warm water port. For the whole country. A country that spans two continents. Look back on how America treated 'Panama'. America has dozens of warm water ports on both oceans, and it overthrew countries a thousand miles away to secure shipping convenience. It's inconceivable how long Russia has a…

> Crimea contains Russia's _only_ warm water port.

Stop repeating Russian propaganda.

Before Crimea Russia already had warm water port - Novorossiysk.

Re: Why Europe Is Warning of Pax Americana's End

#362

Post by PerfectDlite »

googletazer wrote: post #289
ptaipale wrote: post #168

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well, the bases aren't actual aggression, you know. They're generally built based on agreements with host countries. Most often the host countries enthusiastically welcome them. Invading Georgia is aggression. Invading Ukraine is aggression. Sending "little green men" over is. Sending anti-aircraft batteries to shoot down civilian planes over the "Novorossiya" puppet regime's controlled area is.

Yeah I saw that CNN interview where the girl from Ossetia was telling what actually happened and then got cut off for "technical difficulties" :). Georgia got off easy. As for Ukraine - yeah Russia occupied Crimea, but it was either that or risk a crack that could disintegrate it entirely. Israel struck first in the 7 day war as well, and good that they did, because otherwise they wouldnt exist. History is full of su…

> Russia occupied Crimea, but it was either that or risk a crack that could disintegrate it entirely.

Oh, so Russia _saved_ Ukraine, not invaded?

I'd yet to see most pretentious whitewashing of Russian war crimes.

Re: Why Europe Is Warning of Pax Americana's End

#363

Post by flukus »

PerfectDlite wrote: post #357
konstmonst wrote: post #151

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What happened in Crimea? What about a referendum? How is it worse than US annexation of Hawai? As a matter of fact, Crimea was part of Russia since it was taken from Crimean Khanate in the 18th century. I also don't have any emphaty for the treatment of Tatar Culture because it was a culture of pillaging their neigbours and economy based on slaves. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crimean_Tatars https://en.wikipedia.org…

> What happened in Crimea? What about a referendum? Referendum was held _after_ invasion and with numerous violations of international laws. > How is it worse than US annexation of Hawai? How's your whataboutism? > As a matter of fact, Crimea was part of Russia since it was taken from Crimean Khanate in the 18th century. Russia (as per se) exists only since 1991.

> Referendum was held _after_ invasion and with numerous violations of international laws.

Because they weren't allowed a referendum as part of the Ukraine.

Re: Why Europe Is Warning of Pax Americana's End

#364

Post by flukus »

zzleeper wrote: post #118
fowlerpower wrote: post #2

This is somewhat overblown, there was a lot of talk about this as it became clear Trump was about to be elected. Yes Trump is stirring the pot a bit maybe to play Russia against China. Maybe it's to get Europe to spend a little more on NATO so the US doesn't fund the vast majority of that alliance and he can cut some spending there. Whatever the mind set is, not much has changed. The US and all of its allies are stil…

"Yes Trump is stirring the pot a bit maybe to play Russia against China. Maybe it's to get Europe to spend a little more on NATO" I don't know in what world do you live, but you are just giving him too much credibility. It's as if you can't fathom him doing something bad in him.

It sounds like your falling into the trap of thinking Trump is an idiot.

Re: Why Europe Is Warning of Pax Americana's End

#365

Post by AnimalMuppet »

tiatia wrote: post #40
Scarblac wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Russia is the Soviet Union's continuation, and it still has a huge arsenal of nuclear weapons and is currently fighting in and occupying a European country. The threat isn't gone at all.

"is currently fighting in and occupying a European country." If Russia were fighting Ukraine, the war would be over in 1 week.

If Russia were fighting Ukraine and trying to steamroll over the whole country, yes. If Russia were trying to chip away at it a little at a time, causing the minimum amount of international outrage and sanctions consistent with eventually getting what they (Russia) want, you might see something very much like the current situation. It's all about deniability rather than swiftness.

Re: Why Europe Is Warning of Pax Americana's End

#366

Post by AnimalMuppet »

tiatia wrote: post #325
seppin wrote: post #319

Earlier quoted context omitted.

B/c they can't invade fully, they need some pretext. Also even if they wanted to, they don't have the forces to occupy Kiev.

"they need some pretext." Russian law would give this pretext. Putin would be obligated by the constitution to protect "Russians" abroad. Ukraine has a huge Russian minority. " Also even if they wanted to, they don't have the forces to occupy Kiev." Ukraine is currently on the level of a 3rd world country. Russia would have air superiority within 24 hours. And the Russian military is still a formidable opponent, even…

They need some pretext that most of the rest of the world will recognize as having some validity.

Re: Why Europe Is Warning of Pax Americana's End

#367

Post by wallace_f »

emodendroket wrote: post #57
wallace_f wrote: post #13

Alternative hypothesis: political populism is rising to popularity levels which endanger the plutocratic and military rulers. Don't think they won't set the stage for future wars just so they can stay in power.

Why would they bother when all of Trump's cabinet is plutocrats and they're pursuing a radical pro-business agenda?

Douglas Adams:

/* “It comes from a very ancient democracy, you see..." "You mean, it comes from a world of lizards?" "No," said Ford, who by this time was a little more rational and coherent than he had been, having finally had the coffee forced down him, "nothing so simple. Nothing anything like so straightforward. On its world, the people are people. The leaders are lizards. The people hate the lizards and the lizards rule the people." "Odd," said Arthur, "I thought you said it was a democracy." "I did," said Ford. "It is." "So," said Arthur, hoping he wasn't sounding ridiculously obtuse, "why don't people get rid of the lizards?" "It honestly doesn't occur to them," said Ford. "They've all got the vote, so they all pretty much assume that the government they've voted in more or less approximates to the government they want." "You mean they actually vote for the lizards?" "Oh yes," said Ford with a shrug, "of course." "But," said Arthur, going for the big one again, "why?" "Because if they didn't vote for a lizard," said Ford, "the wrong lizard might get in. Got any gin?" /

Trump is the wrong lizard.*

95% of the media you see and hear (more if you just read the paper and watch cable news, which I gather is the vast majority of the US population) is owned by one of five corporations. CNN is telling us, verbatim, that "it's illegal to read Wikileaks," while civil and human rights abuses go on every day in America while the media remains silent on many of them.

Look, HRC and DT are both evil, awful people. Let's stop fighting about which lizard gets in--after all, that's what they want--and start thinking about how we can make it so you don't have to be a lizard to get in. The real people that hold power are the ones that win after every election. One example: https://theintercept.com/2016/12/09/trump-makes-america-gold...

Re: Why Europe Is Warning of Pax Americana's End

#368

Post by [deleted] »

DarkKomunalec wrote: post #297
Elrac wrote: post #281

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm sorry, but I'm too lazy to dig up those statistics for you. Part of the reason is that I consider your question to be fundamentally misdirected. First, I'd like to point out that medical staff form just the tip of the iceberg in terms of wage-reduction by immigrants. For example, my father in law lives in an old age home staffed almost entirely with low-wage foreigners - a mix of immigrants, migrants, what-have y…

Fleeing from countries such as Turkey, Greece, Bulgaria, Serbia, Bosnia, Croatia, and Slovenia? And pretending there are only two options - let them stay forever, or gun them down at the border, is dishonest at best. We ship food half way around the world, there's no reason wealthy countries can't fund refugee camps and in general help and give aid to countries that accept refugees. This would also reduce the number…

[deleted]

Re: Why Europe Is Warning of Pax Americana's End

#369

Post by gbog »

ced wrote: post #240
gbog wrote: post #119

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Food issues is the very reason for me to raise my kids in China. They learn to use chopsticks before forks and knives. They eat rice daily and have no desert. I sometime had to literally tell my daughter: "if you do not eat this chocolate cake, I'll not give you more bone soup". There is a very big food problem... in the US. Also, there is a very annoying problem with people of other colors in the West. I do not want…

That's interesting. Would you mind going into specifics? Are you American? How long have you been there, and what are the main challenges? I see you're in Beijing. I lived in Kunming, and it did seem like a pretty appropriate place for having a family. Are you concerned about the pollution levels? What kind of school do you send your kids to, if any?

I'm French, have been in China for more than 10 years, my wife is Chinese, kids go to French school. People over-react to pollution in Beijing: it is only 2/3 days a month and still way below levels of most other capitals in SE Asia. And as the air is very dry, the impact on the lungs is not what it would be in a more humid place, dixit two physicians.

There are downsides obviously, but food, safety, and housekeeping help are on the upside, especially with kids.

Re: Why Europe Is Warning of Pax Americana's End

#370

Post by gbog »

del82 wrote: post #306
gbog wrote: post #119

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Food issues is the very reason for me to raise my kids in China. They learn to use chopsticks before forks and knives. They eat rice daily and have no desert. I sometime had to literally tell my daughter: "if you do not eat this chocolate cake, I'll not give you more bone soup". There is a very big food problem... in the US. Also, there is a very annoying problem with people of other colors in the West. I do not want…

You're absolutely right that from a dietary perspective, and painting with a very broad brush, Chinese people in general eat healthier than Americans. My spouse certainly eats healthier than I do, though I've been a bit of a bad influence. My point was about food safety, not nutrition. To some extent I can control how healthily my children eat by choosing what to feed them. But while in the US we can be fairly confid…

One scandal doesn't make a general rule. Also as your wife is Chinese you certainly noticed that Chinese people are obsessed with food. In some place like Sichuan it is the only conversation topic that's ever talked about. With such an obsession, a restaurant won't last a week if it's serving bad food. I have seen it with my colleagues, one had a "laduzi" and told others, the next the restaurant had no more patrons from our company, it's a kind of blacklist.
Post reply on HN