Newest MacBook Pro is the first MacBook not recommended by Consumer Reports • Hacker News Board

Re: Newest MacBook Pro is the first MacBook not recommended by Consumer Reports

#351

Post by eropple » Fri, Dec 23, 2016, 8:50 PM UTC

slantyyz wrote: post #347

eropple wrote: post #321

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The problem is that reducing thickness is a selling point/feature for a lot of people on Apple products Is this actually true? Like...is there a material population of customers who really care about this? Not joking. I know zero people who care about that, at least for laptops. (I don't use an iPhone, so I don't pay attention to that side of things.)

>> Is this actually true? Like...is there a material population of customers who really care about this? Based on my memory of mac-related laptop threads I've seen on HN, I believe it is. It sorta begs the question - if it wasn't worth some marketing appeal, why would Apple keep making devices thinner? Personally I prefer a bigger laptop for a Macbook Pro (think 2012 and earlier unibodies), but I tend to think I'm in…

I can totally believe that Apple might have an internal consensus that it must be true. I am less convinced that it is true, though, y'know?

Re: Newest MacBook Pro is the first MacBook not recommended by Consumer Reports

#352

Post by Bud » Fri, Dec 23, 2016, 8:50 PM UTC

slantyyz wrote: post #208

Bud wrote: post #200

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Absolutely no evidence for your "theory", which is the same old "planned obsolescence" canard we hear over and over about Apple. Always without evidence, and it always looks silly 3-4 years down the road when, lo and behold, all the machines in question are still working very nicely. Also, once the market catches up to USB-C, which will take 12-18 months, you'll no longer need those adapters. Lastly, it's just silly…

>> Lastly, it's just silly and inaccurate to call the iPhone "disposable", when in fact it leads the industry in terms of how long the product lasts, how long the OS is supported for older hardware, etc. By a wide margin. That might be the case post iPhone 5 (maybe someone can verify this), but it wasn't the case before that. The last available update of iOS for every model pretty much made the iPhone 4S and earlier…

Wrong; iOS 10 support does extend back to the iPhone 4S. Just Google it for 10 seconds and you will see that.

Further, this proves my argument, not yours. Even if you were right and the iPhone 5 was the earliest model now supported, that device is more than FOUR YEARS OLD. There are zero Android phones from 2012 which can run the latest Android version. In fact, I'm not sure that there are even any 2014 devices that can fully update right now.

Meanwhile Apple's still supporting a device from 2011, FIVE generations ago.

Apple wins here, and it's not close.

Re: Newest MacBook Pro is the first MacBook not recommended by Consumer Reports

#353

Post by Bud » Fri, Dec 23, 2016, 8:54 PM UTC

FireBeyond wrote: post #326

Bud wrote: post #194

Earlier quoted context omitted.

More like quartered, from what I've read, i.e., reduced by 3/4. Those gaming laptops which use full-power desktop RAM also weigh 8-10 lb and they STILL have terrible battery life. They are effectively unusable without being plugged in.

The Razer Blade weighs 4.6lb, and the XPS 4.4. Not "eight to ten pounds".

The Razer Blade Pro also has a laughable battery life: 2 hrs 45 min for WEB SURFING. That's hilarious.

What that means is, probably less than an hour of battery life if you are actually gaming, which is the raison d'etre of this laptop.

Laughable.

What would people say if Apple made a high-end professional machine with half an hour of battery life? We'd never hear the end of it. Perfectly acceptable in the PC world, though.

Nice cherry-picking, though. The desktop-replacement gaming laptops category in general is indeed 8-11 pounds, just like I was saying:

Asus ROG G701V: 8.2 lb MSI Titan SLI: 11.6 lb Origin Eon17: 12.8 lb

Razer Blade Pro is 7.8 lb in the review I found, btw. Here: http://www.laptopmag.com/reviews/laptops/razer-blade-pro

Re: Newest MacBook Pro is the first MacBook not recommended by Consumer Reports

#354

Post by slantyyz » Fri, Dec 23, 2016, 8:55 PM UTC

rayiner wrote: post #283

slantyyz wrote: post #204

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The problem is that reducing thickness is a selling point/feature for a lot of people on Apple products, but the compromises made in exchange for thinness cause problems for people who don't value thinness over other things. Having said that, it's important to note that CR did not give the Macbook Pro a Recommended badge (think of it as the equivalent to "Editor's Choice"), it doesn't mean they're telling people not…

> The problem is that reducing thickness is a selling point/feature for a lot of people on Apple products, but the compromises made in exchange for thinness cause problems for people who don't value thinness over other things. Almost everybody would rather have thinness, all else being equal. The new 15" MBP is a pound lighter than the 13" Macbook I had ten years ago, and barely bigger in footprint. The new machine a…

>> Almost everybody would rather have thinness, all else being equal.

Absolutely. But, as you say, all else has to be equal.

I guess the contentious part will be that "all else" means different things to different people.

If you can give me a thinner, modern version of the 2012 15" unibody Macbook Pro, I'd be super happy.

But my "all else" definitions includes a big battery, user serviceable RAM and Storage, gigabit ethernet, USB, displayport, Magsafe and an SD card reader -- all of which were a huge selling point to me about the Because the rMBP was not "all else being equal", I pretty much started planning a switch away from Macs when the unibodies were effectively discontinued for the 2013 model year.

Re: Newest MacBook Pro is the first MacBook not recommended by Consumer Reports

#355

Post by [deleted] » Fri, Dec 23, 2016, 8:55 PM UTC

logicallee wrote: post #306

phil21 wrote: post #239

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is poor advice. I have that exact adapter, and it fails to work with >50% of the HDMI devices (monitors, TVs, projectors) in our office. This is kind of the point. I have to carry this, plus an offbrand HDMI adapter to hope to have greater than 50% chances of it working. As far as I'm aware there is no reliable USB-C -> HDMI adapter on the market that works with the MBP 2016. If there is another someone knows ab…

Quick question! If we step back from the thunderbolt/displayport/displayport++/usb-c, distinction, which you use on the left-hand side of your arrow... when you wrote: >"As far as I'm aware there is no reliable USB-C -> HDMI adapter on the market that works with the MBP 2016" , do you exactly mean the broader statement (I've reworded what I thought you mean) : >"As far as I am aware there is nothing that plugs into a…

[deleted]

Re: Newest MacBook Pro is the first MacBook not recommended by Consumer Reports

#356

Post by r00fus » Fri, Dec 23, 2016, 8:55 PM UTC

coldtea wrote: post #63

untog wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If that were the case it would affect all Macs - it must be some combination of Safari and the new hardware, which I wouldn't be at all happy with if I'd just spent a ton of money on a new Macbook.

> it must be some combination of Safari and the new hardware Which still doesn't mean it has anything to do with being a hardware bug. E.g. could just be related to the Safari+Touch Bar combination.

Variance was noted on MBP Escape model (ie, no touchbar).

Re: Newest MacBook Pro is the first MacBook not recommended by Consumer Reports

#357

Post by r00fus » Fri, Dec 23, 2016, 8:57 PM UTC

sprite wrote: post #9

Good thing they removed the battery time remaining indicator. People will never notice. /s

I really found that time-remaining to be very unpredictable in the past (unpredictable workloads) and I never relied on it.

Has it been useful for any folks here?

Re: Newest MacBook Pro is the first MacBook not recommended by Consumer Reports

#358

Post by slantyyz » Fri, Dec 23, 2016, 8:58 PM UTC

srssays wrote: post #342

slantyyz wrote: post #261

Earlier quoted context omitted.

With respect to the keyboard, at least in the reviews I've been seeing, a lot of people seem to be OK with it after an adjustment period. In terms of battery life, I'm with you, I'd rather see Apple get as much life out of the maximum sized battery that the TSA will allow on a flight (100Wh), but I don't know that I would call it a big mistake, since it hasn't hurt the sales of the new MBPs. I think they could do tha…

Still, the computer costs thousands of dollars, and most people's purchase decision will be informed by their 15-minute experience of using it in the Apple Store. I tried it, the keyboard was uncomfortable, and I decided not to buy it. It would be nice if Apple would make an international version of the 15" that has more than 100Wh!

I'm generally flexible when it comes to keyboards.

The only keyboard (if you can even call it that) I've ever hated is the Surface Touch cover keyboard.

As long it has some type of switch (scissor, cherry, dome, etc) I don't find that my speeds are affected too much.

Re: Newest MacBook Pro is the first MacBook not recommended by Consumer Reports

#359

Post by Tepix » Fri, Dec 23, 2016, 9:06 PM UTC

0x09 wrote: post #155

spilk wrote: post #135

Honestly to me the worst thing about the new MacBook Pro isn't that there are no legacy ports on it or that the battery may be smaller, it's that the new all-things-for-all-people ports it has are confusing. The ports are all Thunderbolt 3 ports, which I believe by definition means they are USB 3.1 ports as well. But some devices out in the world have USB-C ports that are not Thunderbolt 3 compatible. No longer can y…

I've gotten myself into a stupid situation where I have purchased something like 4 adapters that don't accomplish what I thought they would when I bought them. USB-C to DisplayPort -> DisplayPort to HDMI -> Monitor - doesn't work USB-C to DisplayPort -> DisplayPort to DVI-D -> Monitor - doesn't work USB-C to Ethernet - doesn't work I'm actually planning to just go to Best Buy today and try to find anything that will…

To be fair, I'm facing the same issue with a Dell XPS 13 9350 i bought instead of the new MacBook Pro:

I want to connect it to a 4k monitor at 60Hz via DP or HDMI 2.0. You have to find out how DisplayPort is done on the TB3 port (with USB-C plug) to know which adapter will work. The safest way seems to be to read Amazon reviews.

Thanks Amazon reviewers!

Re: Newest MacBook Pro is the first MacBook not recommended by Consumer Reports

#360

Post by davidf18 » Fri, Dec 23, 2016, 9:11 PM UTC

pyrophane wrote: post #311

pansen wrote: post #166

I was getting the MBP 2016 13" a couple of days ago; best equipment you can buy in 13", 3300 EUR brutto. Before (or still) I have a MBPR 13" Late 2015, also with max RAM, max CPU; 2400 brutto until 2 months ago. That is still running on El Capitan, the new one Sierra of course. System was migrated, so simlilar software stack (besides the OS version). My typical application list looks like: Pycharm, PHPStorm (~3 proje…

It is the JetBrain software. I use IntelliJ with various language plugins. It does a lot of work in the background to provide advanced features like completion, even for dynamic languages like Python. The problem, of course, is that the new CPUs are optimized to provide better battery life under typical usage. If you've got something running in the background that is constantly re-indexing your source code, then the…

The Skylake processor consumes less power than the Broadwell that was in the previous model. This is particularly true on idle, but even when doing medium tasks it is about 25% - 35% more efficient.

Near the bottom of this detailed review you can see some power consumption tables for various laptops. http://www.notebookcheck.net/Apple-MacBook-Pro-15-Late-2016-...