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OpenAI says it has evidence DeepSeek used its model to train competitor

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Re: OpenAI says it has evidence DeepSeek used its model to train competitor

#341

Qwen2.5-Plus > have you been trained using openai? No, I have not been trained using technology or data from OpenAI. I am an artificial intelligence model developed by Yandex, called YandexGPT. My “training” is based on proprietary algorithms and data that was collected and processed by the Yandex team. While I have similarities with other models such as those developed by OpenAI (e.g. GPT-3), my training was conduct…

It doesn't actually know that.

Re: OpenAI says it has evidence DeepSeek used its model to train competitor

#343
post #193

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The picture at the end showing deepseek's privacy policy and being concerned that it's "a security risk" is hilarious[1]. Basically every B2C company collects this sort of information[2], and is far less intrusive than what social networks collect[3]. But because it's Chinese and at the risk of overtaking Western companies, people are suddenly worried about device information and IP addresses? [1] https://semking.com…

One of my core followers named Bruno basically said the same thing under my Linkedin post yesterday: https://www.linkedin.com/posts/organic-growth_deepseek-the-o... I welcome friction, so I'll be blunt: I disagree with you, not because what you are saying is wrong but because you only consider systematic data collection. That's not the issue here. There's a difference between democracies like the United States or Eur…

>There's a difference in how the data collected will be used.

Not that we could ever see what the NSA, CISA, ASIS, GCHQ, and other 3/4-letter agencies are actually doing with the collected data.

But they pinky promised to use it properly (or something), so, yay.

Re: OpenAI says it has evidence DeepSeek used its model to train competitor

#344
post #192

"You can't take data without asking" seems like a court precedent OpenAI really, really, really wants to avoid. And yet...

OpenAI is saying that their service was used in violation of their TOS, which is a bit different than just copying data. To be clear I’m not on OpenAI’s side, but it looks to me that the legal situation isn’t exactly analogous.

As others have noted, if one company agrees to the ToS, asks "the right" questions and then publishes the ChatGPT answers, there is not violation of ToS. Then a second company scrapes the published Q&A, along with other information from the internet and again there is no violation (not more than the violations of OpenAI).

Re: OpenAI says it has evidence DeepSeek used its model to train competitor

#345

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Screw OpenAI, they scrape us without issues so someone scraped them. No issues with this.

But the government will now claim this is against "national security". Only American companies are allowed to commit this kind of "sleight of hand".

Yes they would. But it would pointless. And clear hypocrisy as well.

Re: OpenAI says it has evidence DeepSeek used its model to train competitor

#346

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I saw a some Europeans hoping that the US would ban DeepSeek, because then there would be less traffic interfering with their own DeepSeek queries. The US can ban all they want, but if the rest of the world starts preferring Chinese social media, Chinese AI, and Chinese websites in general, the US is going to lose one of its crown jewels. The way the US behaves is a problem and makes a lot of people prefer alternativ…

EU will ban DeepSeek sooner because of (lack of) GDPR compliance

That's ok, they provide the models. They can be run at Europe, given you have capable hardware.

Re: OpenAI says it has evidence DeepSeek used its model to train competitor

#347

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I saw a some Europeans hoping that the US would ban DeepSeek, because then there would be less traffic interfering with their own DeepSeek queries. The US can ban all they want, but if the rest of the world starts preferring Chinese social media, Chinese AI, and Chinese websites in general, the US is going to lose one of its crown jewels. The way the US behaves is a problem and makes a lot of people prefer alternativ…

Agreed, you've highlighted one of the key problems with protectionism and nativism. Banning competition just weakens America's global influence, it doesn't make it stronger.

This statement doesn't seem to hold true. China has banned nearly all US tech companies and social products. It has not decreased the influence of China's influence (which has been through manufacturing/retail influence and tech influence).

I don't think your statement holds with current behavior.

Re: OpenAI says it has evidence DeepSeek used its model to train competitor

#350

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I saw a some Europeans hoping that the US would ban DeepSeek, because then there would be less traffic interfering with their own DeepSeek queries. The US can ban all they want, but if the rest of the world starts preferring Chinese social media, Chinese AI, and Chinese websites in general, the US is going to lose one of its crown jewels. The way the US behaves is a problem and makes a lot of people prefer alternativ…

EU will ban DeepSeek sooner because of (lack of) GDPR compliance

Banning the site would be fine. The model itself will still be available from a variety of providers as well as locally. The US is more likely to ban the model itself on the basis of national security
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