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United States Files Civil Lawsuit Against Edward Snowden

justice.gov

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Re: United States Files Civil Lawsuit Against Edward Snowden

#341

Post by weare138 »

jstewartmobile wrote: post #311
weare138 wrote: post #308

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No offense, but what does this have to do with Snowden?

if OC weren't flagged, we could see samstave's tie-in. my tie-in would be that we are ruled by evil people, and could really use an army of snowdens.

True, I couldn't read the OP's post. And yes, there's no shortage of f*cked up people in the world in positions of power who's actions affect the rest of us but we don't need an "army of Snowdens". No "army of Snowdens" will save us from ourselves. There is no master plan, no global conspiracy, no deep state or ancient secret society behind the scenes working toward some nefarious goal that only the select sinister few are privy to. In reality they're just a small minority of sociopaths and corrupt egomaniacal degenerates that gained power over the majority. Which is usually what motivates these type of people. The corrupt few rule the the rest of us because we allow it to happen.

Re: United States Files Civil Lawsuit Against Edward Snowden

#343

Post by mhh__ »

mirimir wrote: post #318
monocasa wrote: post #305

Earlier quoted context omitted.

He was under a deadline, and then gave the files to journalists to decide what they thought was in the best interest, and then those journalists ran everything they were going to release by the DoD beforehand. What more should he have done?

I think that he should have dumped everything. Or at least, everything that didn't put individuals at risk. I get where he was coming from. But the people in charge of releasing stuff seem too clueless and/or deferential.

Dumping all of it online would have been like wikileaks, which I think would've been a mistake in that Wikileaks have been very open about aiming to use there releases to influence politics rather than merely releasing for the sake of knowledge e.g. "Maximum political impact" which does make them less credible (Aside from the dubious links to and decision not to criticise russia)

Re: United States Files Civil Lawsuit Against Edward Snowden

#344

Post by jstewartmobile »

weare138 wrote: post #341
jstewartmobile wrote: post #311

Earlier quoted context omitted.

if OC weren't flagged, we could see samstave's tie-in. my tie-in would be that we are ruled by evil people, and could really use an army of snowdens.

True, I couldn't read the OP's post. And yes, there's no shortage of f*cked up people in the world in positions of power who's actions affect the rest of us but we don't need an "army of Snowdens". No "army of Snowdens" will save us from ourselves. There is no master plan, no global conspiracy, no deep state or ancient secret society behind the scenes working toward some nefarious goal that only the select sinister f…

Most conspiracy theories are disinformation to spur people to action. Most "official" narratives coming out of our news organs and bureaucracies are disinformation to keep people pacified and complacent.

To the cautious man, which is more dangerous?

Re: United States Files Civil Lawsuit Against Edward Snowden

#345

Post by s_y_n_t_a_x »

skyyler wrote: post #340
burtonator wrote: post #252

Earlier quoted context omitted.

He could probably help with these accusations by releasing his tax returns. :)

I don't follow US politics. How would that help? Legitimate question.

It wouldn't. They're just trying to get their talking point in.

Re: United States Files Civil Lawsuit Against Edward Snowden

#346

Post by chii »

cwkoss wrote: post #295
maxlybbert wrote: post #233

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Snowden got a job handling classified material. The government only trusted him to handle that material because he signed various contracts that said he would keep the material secret and that he would allow the NSA to read anything he wanted to publish so they could be sure he didn’t accidentally leak something (and, potentially, so they could plan for damage control). This lawsuit is not actually about publishing c…

The most fundamental part of his job was to uphold the US constitution. After numerous attempts to stop the constitutional violations of the NSA from within, he chose to uphold the constitution rather than the orders of unelected power hungry spooks. Frankly, hundreds if not thousands of people within the NSA deserve to be charged with treason. I would be shocked if this actually happened, though.

Upholding the constitution is not a citizen's job. It is the supreme court's.

You can invoke your constitutional rights as a citizen,but you don't get to enforce it on behalf of somebody else, nor do you as an individual, decide what action constitutes a violation.

Re: United States Files Civil Lawsuit Against Edward Snowden

#347

Post by 4ntonius8lock »

txcwpalpha wrote: post #276
mattkrause wrote: post #227

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're making this way more mysterious-sounding than it is. As the text says, those first categories are INTENDED for sealed letters. Things shipped in those ways therefore retain the privacy protections of letters. You can put a (small) rock or whatever in there instead--that's your business--and if you do, the Post Office will never know because they're applying the letter-privacy standard and not looking inside. T…

That simply isn't the case though. First Class Mail (and Priority Mail) are specifically intended for both "letters" as well as "things". A glance at the USPS website shows this. Indeed, even in the CFR you quoted, it specifically mentions certain types of "package" services as sealed mail. I don't know where you're getting that there is a specific "intention" for anything.

No, first class mail specifically is for commercial sending. It even has commercial requirements:

> Standard mail must be less than 16 ounces and must meet a minimum quantity of 200 pieces or 50 pounds of mail.

Your obstinacy in the face of overwhelming evidence against what you are saying is amazing. I feel for you. Life is hard when you act that way (I should know, I've fallen in those patterns at times)

Re: United States Files Civil Lawsuit Against Edward Snowden

#348

Post by adsteel_ »

peteretep wrote: post #339
cwkoss wrote: post #310

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Snowdens most fundamental job requirement was to uphold the US constitution. He tried to stop gross constitutional violations from within using the official processes and was ignored. He is the greatest American hero of our era for sacrificing his own freedom to protect the nation. The NSA employees who are 'just following orders' are little better than Nazi footsolders in 1940s Germany. Their continued violation of…

> Snowdens most fundamental job requirement was to uphold the US constitution This feels like one of those things that Americans say, that may not be true. Is this actually true? Do NSA employees state such an oath? Is defense of the constitution more important than defense of the nation if the two are in conflict? Happy to be persuaded that this is true, but feels pretty glib to a non-American.

He took an oath to defend the constitution as part joining the NSA. Many google results, here's one: https://www.newyorker.com/news/amy-davidson/did-edward-snowd...

Re: United States Files Civil Lawsuit Against Edward Snowden

#349

Post by 100100010001 »

indigochill wrote: post #66
omarhaneef wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I see the same issue with the other debate raging on HN: Stallman and Free Speech. The issue is that people -- not sure whether it was OP, or you -- conflate what is moral with what is legal. One person starts off with a moral premise: people should have free speech, or people should have the right to say what the government is doing. Someone else responds with what is legal : the law applies to government curtailmen…

I agree with your observation and statement, but also want to add there is a moral argument that if one objects to a law or a contract, one should remove oneself from under it (leave the country/company) rather than break it, even if the law itself is immoral. Not that I'm arguing one way or another how that applies in this situation, though.

Does that mean every government agent that broke the law and spied on American citizens should be deported?

Re: United States Files Civil Lawsuit Against Edward Snowden

#350

Post by samstave »

weare138 wrote: post #341
jstewartmobile wrote: post #311

Earlier quoted context omitted.

if OC weren't flagged, we could see samstave's tie-in. my tie-in would be that we are ruled by evil people, and could really use an army of snowdens.

True, I couldn't read the OP's post. And yes, there's no shortage of f*cked up people in the world in positions of power who's actions affect the rest of us but we don't need an "army of Snowdens". No "army of Snowdens" will save us from ourselves. There is no master plan, no global conspiracy, no deep state or ancient secret society behind the scenes working toward some nefarious goal that only the select sinister f…

Here was my post

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Also if you enable “read dead” in your prefs on hn you will still see flagged and dead posts:

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-2 points by samstave 3 hours ago | parent [flagged] [-] | on: US Files Lawsuit Against Edward Snowden for Violat...

Snowden is a national hero. Period. I don’t care what any one thinks otherwise, but we would be a more authoritarian and fascist place without Snowden, Schwartz, (whom YC funded and he was suicided), Manning etc So fuck the #pedopaths and fuck anyone who is against any of the above and fuck you YC for being against truth. This is what killed Aaron Schwartz https://drop.space/watch/amazing-polly-epstein-stories-you-w.... He wasn’t stealing JSTOR docs - he was going after pedopaths and he went to the MIT media lab to get docs on the pedopaths and was then suicided because he knew the truth And I’ll be downvoted by idiots who think they are smart and don’t know the real world we live in. As an aside - where are all you jerks who work for palantir? Your company was just on NPR today talking about how you have been ghosting. If you work for palantir, you are a criminal, period. I love the downvotes by the willfully ignorants. Keep them coming.

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