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Facebook Indefinitely Suspends Trump

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Re: Facebook Indefinitely Suspends Trump

#331

Post by minimaxir »

matz1 wrote: post #276
th0ma5 wrote: post #231

All of these HN comments are defending shouting "Fire!" falsely in a theater under the guise of it being a slippery slope before all speech is lost. I have lost a lot of respect for these slippery slope arguments because they are easy to make and ignore the obvious problem which is that some speech shouldn't be tolerated... Especially intolerant or harmful speech.

> which is that some speech shouldn't be tolerated who get to decide what should/shouln't be tolerated ? harmful/harmful ? facebook ?

"Inciting a coup" is a pretty unambiguous bar for harmful speech.

Re: Facebook Indefinitely Suspends Trump

#332

Post by NN88 »

aprdm wrote: post #44

Regardless of being the right thing to do or not, it is very interesting to see a software platform banning a president of a country. Interesting times.

I have a social media platform that I created that Trump isn't on. Did I deplatform him?

Re: Facebook Indefinitely Suspends Trump

#333

Post by tomp »

dkjaudyeqooe wrote: post #282
makomk wrote: post #243

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Right now, FB are getting to have their cake and eat it - Section 230 gives them almost complete immunity from how they use their "voice" on the supposed basis that it's supposedly their users' speech and not theirs, including getting to decide which political violence to support, but they also get full freedom to decide which not-their-speech gets heard and by whom based on their own whims. Ordinary humans who aren'…

Of course you can have this level of free speech rights, just start a website with a comments section and you can have the same awesome power.

Unapproved speech will be censored somehow, if necessary at the DNS / internet provider / Cloudflare level. Case in point: Daily Stormer.

Re: Facebook Indefinitely Suspends Trump

#334

Post by dionian »

jpsalm wrote: post #174
andrewclunn wrote: post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ah yes, either Trump is a cult leader who is threatening the very core of our democracy, or the election was rigged and we're about to get a Chinese style Manchurian candidate in the White House. I'm so glad that the media vigorously looked into these allegations of corruption and fraud, instead of dismissing them for partisan reasons, because then we might have a split, between people who get their information from…

The allegations were thrown out by every court they got brought to and by conservative judges as well. It's a farce and you're the sheep getting fleeced.

I'm tired of seeing this talking point echoed when pretty much every case was dismissed on process (standing or "Laches")

Re: Facebook Indefinitely Suspends Trump

#335

Post by q3 »

andrepd wrote: post #175

I don't like the thought of trillion-dollar advertising companies being the custodians of the platforms where (sadly) a majority of speech in the world happens. That being said, if direct calls to violence and to insurrection against a democracy aren't grounds to take away your megaphone, then what is? If you're a free speech maximalist you'll be opposed to any sort of "censorship" (then again, people with those view…

>direct calls to violence and to insurrection against a democracy

Did Trump really call for violence? Are those tweets still accessible somewhere? (Serious question, I did not follow his account.)

Re: Facebook Indefinitely Suspends Trump

#336

Post by gpm »

andrepd wrote: post #175

I don't like the thought of trillion-dollar advertising companies being the custodians of the platforms where (sadly) a majority of speech in the world happens. That being said, if direct calls to violence and to insurrection against a democracy aren't grounds to take away your megaphone, then what is? If you're a free speech maximalist you'll be opposed to any sort of "censorship" (then again, people with those view…

I don't quite disagree with this, but I'm willing to defend those who do because a slightly different weighting in my priorities would make my disagree.

Inciting violence should be punished by the law, not by Facebook. For regular people it makes sense to outsource some of this to Facebook, to minimize the load on the legal system. POTUS however is one very high profile person. His statements are not being missed by those who have the authority to enforce the law. There is public debate ongoing over what should be done. Facebook should not need to help out here.

Of course, as a result of an ubstroctionist attorney general (the baseless memo protecting the president from prosecution) and Senate (refusing to convict for political reasons) Facebook might actually be the best practical route, but them having to take that roll is actively damaging to society.

Re: Facebook Indefinitely Suspends Trump

#337

Post by coldtea »

sandworm101 wrote: post #294
lalos wrote: post #69

Interesting how they sing a different tune once the other party finally gets certification of the election results, time to get 'cozy' with the new people in power and set up those dinners [1] and ad deals with them. [1] https://www.nbcnews.com/tech/tech-news/trump-hosted-zuckerbe...

>> time to get 'cozy' with the new people in power and set up those dinners That is the system. Companies that want to make money need to keep on the good side of people in power. But isn't that how democracy works? Better that they adapt to every incoming elected administration than have them hold loyalties to old regimes. Seeing them so regularly bend to the will of voters isn't a horrible thing.

>Companies that want to make money need to keep on the good side of people in power. But isn't that how democracy works?

No, that's how a republic might work. In democracy companies are not allowed to yield such power, and people elected can be revoked at any time....

Re: Facebook Indefinitely Suspends Trump

#338

Post by vharuck »

ajsnigrutin wrote: post #83
rasengan wrote: post #23

Facebook is not a platform to have a voice. It’s a platform that harvests thoughts and publicizes the ones FB most agrees with while censoring those it does not. This is a slippery slope and, quite frankly, it’s the people that lose.

Yep, but the problem with people commenting there is, that thay don't like Trump, and cheer for his removal.... when the turntables are turned, and someone else is cheering, it'll be too late, because the precedent has been set, and we've let them do it.

This reasoning means nobody can ever be held responsible, because "What if it's me?" I like to assume the majority of people are good. So even when I support the right thing, I don't have to worry about turned tables.

Re: Facebook Indefinitely Suspends Trump

#340

Post by simias »

finder83 wrote: post #324
andrepd wrote: post #175

I don't like the thought of trillion-dollar advertising companies being the custodians of the platforms where (sadly) a majority of speech in the world happens. That being said, if direct calls to violence and to insurrection against a democracy aren't grounds to take away your megaphone, then what is? If you're a free speech maximalist you'll be opposed to any sort of "censorship" (then again, people with those view…

Do you have examples of the direct calls to violence and insurrection? Supposedly there were three tweets that Twitter required trump to delete, but I don't see the actual text of them anywhere.

I had one screenshot before it was taken down because I couldn't believe what I was reading: https://svkt.org/~simias/up/20210107-164543_trump.png
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