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VoidZero Is Joining Cloudflare

blog.cloudflare.com

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Re: VoidZero Is Joining Cloudflare

#301

Post by WhyNotHugo »

freedomben wrote: post #126

> Before saying anything else, we want to make the most important thing clear: Vite, Vitest, Rolldown, Oxc, and Vite+ will stay open source, vendor-agnostic, and community-driven. Nothing about that changes. Appreciate them putting that so clearly. I am highly skeptical of acquisitions now because we've been burned so many times in the past. Time will tell if this stays true, but at least it's clearly on the record.…

It's natural to be sceptical. They're investing a huge amount of money and claiming that nothing will change. I.e.: that they seek nothing in return.

Re: VoidZero Is Joining Cloudflare

#302

Post by mattstir »

catapart wrote: post #226
hntiz wrote: post #22

I think, just from a purely build-step point of view, it's been evident that tools like Vite, Bun, etc. have achieved all they meaningfully can. If I was the creator of these tools, I've move on too. Good luck and thanks for everything.

lol. any of them - literally just ONE - could have a full blown UI so that you wouldn't have to build projects using a command line like it's 1985. or maybe one of them could just invest in packaging custom html elements, instead of assuming I'm going to use one of a handful of unnecessary "component" libraries, or assuming that I won't be using components at all. there's plenty of places for these tools to go, but n…

> or maybe one of them could just invest in packaging custom html elements, instead of assuming I'm going to use one of a handful of unnecessary "component" libraries

... are these not the same thing? I suppose from a technical standpoint they'd differ, but they achieve the same result: reusable, modular building blocks for creating interfaces.

Re: VoidZero Is Joining Cloudflare

#303

Post by mattstir »

opem wrote: post #238
havaloc wrote: post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I like how I can slap up a free Turnstile on my projects in two minutes and not have to worry about endless comment spam and user registration spam. Yes, I understand there's problems with Cloudflare, but there's also a lot of problems out there in the wild west of an open internet.

Ah! The same turnstile that was supposed to provide users with a more private reCaptcha alternative and ended up fingerprinting users via WebGL to prevent spam.

Yes? It's unclear how they'd do their job without extensive fingerprinting. I don't like it either, but pretending like it's not better positioned from a privacy standpoint is odd. At very least, turnstile isn't ran by the world's largest ads company that directly profits from accurately tracking users across the web.

Re: VoidZero Is Joining Cloudflare

#304

Post by joeyhage »

conartist6 wrote: post #260
joeyhage wrote: post #140

Everything Cloudflare is announcing could have been done without acquiring VoidZero. The part they aren’t saying is the greater influence they will have on the roadmap and protecting themselves from someone else acquiring vite and making it closed source and/or monetizing it. We’ve seen it so many times - a project promises to stay free and open source, but things change. Are there any licenses or contracts that a pr…

>Are there any licenses or contracts that a project could use and would hold up in court that they need to stay FOSS forever? I don't understand, the existing licenses say that, and courts uphold them to say that. If a company has given code to you under an OSS license, that code is yours under that license forever. There'd be no point in trying to bind a person to give you all their future creative output for free j…

What I meant was the project would stay FOSS forever, so that would mean all future updates including features, bug fixes, and patches. My understanding is the license can be changed at any time so then you would only have FOSS access for the code up until the point in time the license changed.

That said, I completely agree that there’s a better solution.

Re: VoidZero Is Joining Cloudflare

#305

Post by TheAlexLichter »

WhyNotHugo wrote: post #301
freedomben wrote: post #126

> Before saying anything else, we want to make the most important thing clear: Vite, Vitest, Rolldown, Oxc, and Vite+ will stay open source, vendor-agnostic, and community-driven. Nothing about that changes. Appreciate them putting that so clearly. I am highly skeptical of acquisitions now because we've been burned so many times in the past. Time will tell if this stays true, but at least it's clearly on the record.…

It's natural to be sceptical. They're investing a huge amount of money and claiming that nothing will change. I.e.: that they seek nothing in return.

Not really. The claim is that nothing will change regarding the OSS projects.

Re: VoidZero Is Joining Cloudflare

#306

Post by brennopost »

Mitochondriac wrote: post #297
avdwrks wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This one is particularly interesting given that Vercel products (Nuxt) now rely on a competitor's tooling (Vite).

Next* the framework for React. Nuxt is the framework for Vue.

Nuxt is also on Vercel

https://vercel.com/blog/nuxtlabs-joins-vercel

Re: VoidZero Is Joining Cloudflare

#307

Post by conartist6 »

joeyhage wrote: post #304
conartist6 wrote: post #260

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Are there any licenses or contracts that a project could use and would hold up in court that they need to stay FOSS forever? I don't understand, the existing licenses say that, and courts uphold them to say that. If a company has given code to you under an OSS license, that code is yours under that license forever. There'd be no point in trying to bind a person to give you all their future creative output for free j…

What I meant was the project would stay FOSS forever, so that would mean all future updates including features, bug fixes, and patches. My understanding is the license can be changed at any time so then you would only have FOSS access for the code up until the point in time the license changed. That said, I completely agree that there’s a better solution.

Unless you literally own me, how would you possibly prevent me from doing new work without giving it to you? Even if I were under an employment contract that assigns all my intellectual property to you, as a free person I would be free to quit that job and cease giving you any further IP.

For the record that my suspicion is that bug fixes to open code are very likely not copyrightable due to the principle of convergence, though I am not a lawyer and to my knowledge this issue has never been tested in court. New features would very much be copyrightable.

Re: VoidZero Is Joining Cloudflare

#308

Post by Sammi »

francislavoie wrote: post #100
Sammi wrote: post #32

The question I have is: Is Vite becoming the all-in-one nodejs tool that is replacing all the other full featured js tooling favorites like Bun, Deno and pnpm?

Vite is not a package manager and is not a JS runtime. That's what Node/Bun/Deno do. Vite is the remaining glue for any web project's build and testing needs.

Bun and Deno are not js runtimes either. They are wrappers for existing js runtimes and add additional apis.

Re: VoidZero Is Joining Cloudflare

#309

Post by francislavoie »

Sammi wrote: post #308
francislavoie wrote: post #100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Vite is not a package manager and is not a JS runtime. That's what Node/Bun/Deno do. Vite is the remaining glue for any web project's build and testing needs.

Bun and Deno are not js runtimes either. They are wrappers for existing js runtimes and add additional apis.

But they give a usable interface and toolkit to the runtime (V8 etc). 99% of users use one of those three.

Re: VoidZero Is Joining Cloudflare

#310

Post by yencabulator »

olingern wrote: post #98

These acquisition announcements always leave me uneasy. There’s a lot of hand waving, “nothing will change and our roadmap will stay the same!” but we can all do basic math and understand that’s not how business works. As an aside, I have to use Cloudlare at work and it’s a pretty awful experience for the medium sized org I’m at. “Hostile UX” is a common complaint. Maybe they should invest money in competing with Ver…

Well, Voidzero already attempted to rugpull the Vite project into a commercial paid licensing for "Vite+" that they then had to back out of and release under MIT because it just didn't work out.

I think Voidzero was already adrift without a plan and this acquihire is literally just that, new employment for the people behind it.

Maybe Cloudflare will allow them to maintain oxc, but expect them to writing features for Cloudflare Workers from now on.

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