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How America lost its love for the stick shift

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Re: How America lost its love for the stick shift

#301

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Even if they are, a CVT saves enough fuel over its lifetime to offset the cost (5 MpG combined more efficient in some cases). The UK is moving away from manuals for hybrid and fully electric vehicles which often use a CVT, or no transmission in some cases (direct drive).

Electric vehicles do use an assembly of gears to adjust ratios for optimal torque - but just the one gear. It's still a transmission.

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Re: How America lost its love for the stick shift

#302

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Would adaptive cruise control in stop-and-go traffic work at all with a manual? When the speed of traffic is vacillating between 0 and 30mph, there's never any one gear that you can stay in for long.

No, it wouldn't. Technically you could have it adapt within a narrow range of speeds, but it would be annoying, fuel-wasting, and worse than just dealing with the speed yourself. CC on stick shifts works fine at steady highway speeds over a consistent grade.

Various manufacturers do sell cars with adaptive cruise control in manuals, but obviously it's limited to whatever gear the car is currently in.

Re: How America lost its love for the stick shift

#303
post #274

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> When I got a Tesla, I realized what I was really looking for was responsiveness. Yup. The responsiveness of an EV makes even a Nissan Leaf feel surprisingly zippy. When I drive my wife's CRV (which has a CVT), it feels bad when I floor it to pass someone and I have to wait for the RPMs to increase before it actually really begins to move. Even in my manual BRZ, it takes me a second to clutch in, give it gas to rev…

My lust for the Roadster is at least partially offset by my desire not to be the kind of guy that drops $250K on a car. We'll see which wins out ...

It's only $250k for a "Founders Series" Roadster. The base model Roadster is only (hah..."only") $200k. So far, there haven't been any features announced for the "Founders Series" other than being one of the first 1,000 Roadsters to come off the line.

Not exactly a feature I give a damn about. Hell, by the time I'm ready to buy a Roadster, there will probably be some used ones available that I will pick up.

Re: How America lost its love for the stick shift

#304

Speaking as someone who has owned a number of sports cars with manual transmissions, I can tell you why I finally made the switch to automatic: Adaptive cruise control in stop and go traffic. I used to have to deal with a six-speed manual transmission in stop and go traffic for an hour every day, and it was pure torture. I mean, sure, it was fun for a weekend drive in the mountains, but it sucked the rest of the time…

Never found paddle shifters to be in the same league as a manual transmission even in modern high performance cars. There's always that bit of lag and delay with automatic that there isn't on a manual.

Re: How America lost its love for the stick shift

#305

Speaking as someone who has owned a number of sports cars with manual transmissions, I can tell you why I finally made the switch to automatic: Adaptive cruise control in stop and go traffic. I used to have to deal with a six-speed manual transmission in stop and go traffic for an hour every day, and it was pure torture. I mean, sure, it was fun for a weekend drive in the mountains, but it sucked the rest of the time…

People always say this, but frankly I find stop-and-go traffic isn't that bad if you put the car into neutral instead of holding down the clutch the whole time. I haven't looked back since I bought my first manual car. I never use cruise control at all though, even when I had an automatic car.

How many hours per day do you spend in stop and go traffic? I spent 20+ years driving stick in hour-long commutes (each way), and I can tell you that there is no free lunch to be found in N.

Re: How America lost its love for the stick shift

#306
post #240

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the most compelling argument surely, is that it's just more fun. You actually feel like you're driving, it makes it more of an active experience. Recently sold a manual car I owned for about 12 years, upgraded to a newer car which is automatic (only because there was no option for manual). Man, I miss driving a manual!

Its absolutely more fun, and that's a pretty compelling argument. And another one is I tell the car what I want to do. Sure it can try to figure it out, but it will never know exactly what I want to do. I can do something quicker than an automatic will know. For example, I'll know I need to be in a lower gear because I'm about to floor it. An automatic can't know that.

Both my cars are stick shifts, and I prefer them for both these reasons (because it's more fun and because you always control what gear you're in). That said, the better modern automatics (at least in sports cars) have true manual modes that will also let you be in complete control of the gear. (Including not automatically up-shifting at redline when in sport/track mode, which is a near necessity on some tracks, where an unwanted upshift will lose you significant time compared to riding the limiter for a few tenths.) So when the comparison is between a good, sporty automatic and a manual, the fun factor is really the only point for the manual. (Still a good point though!)

Re: How America lost its love for the stick shift

#307
post #287

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My previous car, a 2008 Subaru WRX, in manual had cruise control; while it wasn't adaptive, it was the most important thing I will consider in any other manual transmission going forward. Stop-and-go traffic to my previous job made driving a chore and weekends weren't enough. I miss having that kind of control over the car, but the automatic Mazda3 I replaced it with has made that traffic an afterthought.

I test drove a 2008 WRX a while ago and the clutch was pretty heavy, IIRC. I remember thinking to myself "this would be a major pain in traffic".

Definitely. I drive a 6 MPS (Mazdaspeed 6 to the US), and the clutch was a nightmare stuck in Melbourne traffic back when I was commuting.

Re: How America lost its love for the stick shift

#308
post #233

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Enough so you can gradually slow down until they start to move without stopping yourself. Watch how big rig drivers drive in traffic where it is almost required that you don't keep repeatedly stopping.

Big rigs definitely stop in these situations. No matter how much space they try to leave, other drivers speed around them to fill it and they have to stop anyway.

Sometimes they do, more often than not they aren't stopping, and somehow they seem to do better time than me on top of it.

Re: How America lost its love for the stick shift

#309

Speaking as someone who has owned a number of sports cars with manual transmissions, I can tell you why I finally made the switch to automatic: Adaptive cruise control in stop and go traffic. I used to have to deal with a six-speed manual transmission in stop and go traffic for an hour every day, and it was pure torture. I mean, sure, it was fun for a weekend drive in the mountains, but it sucked the rest of the time…

To each their own, but stop and go traffic does not exist in the absence of stoplights if you leave adequate space in front of you. If you tailgate, ride your brakes, or have to stop completely you are contributing to traffic jams behind you. I drive a 6 speed in one of the worst traffic areas in the US every day.

This is arrant nonsense, and is just short of telling everyone who drives in freeway stop and go traffic that they're just idiots who don't know how to drive.

Unless you can control the behavior of adjacent lanes there is no achievable amount of buffer space that eliminates stop and go. The best you can do is increase the glide time between stops. At times you will see, e.g., semis lining up side by side to help keep a zipper merge flowing, etc., but those cases are rare and not understood by other drivers.

Re: How America lost its love for the stick shift

#310

Speaking as someone who has owned a number of sports cars with manual transmissions, I can tell you why I finally made the switch to automatic: Adaptive cruise control in stop and go traffic. I used to have to deal with a six-speed manual transmission in stop and go traffic for an hour every day, and it was pure torture. I mean, sure, it was fun for a weekend drive in the mountains, but it sucked the rest of the time…

My wife and I both have manuals and we sit in stop and go traffic every day. Having to shift in traffic doesn't even register with my brain that it's really anything at all. I simply don't notice.
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