Tell HN: Razorpay a YC company shared donor data under a Section 91 order • Hacker News Board

Re: Tell HN: Razorpay a YC company shared donor data under a Section 91 order

#31

Post by Tepix » Wed, Jul 06, 2022, 1:09 PM UTC

sneak wrote: post #11

notlukesky wrote: post #8

They jailed the CEO of Qwest who refused to share surveillance data with the NSA without a court order. This seems to be prudent in other jurisdictions as well, other than the US and now India of course. https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2007/10/qwest-ceo-nsa-punished...

Apple chose not-jail and not-ban when faced with the requirement that all iCloud users in China be subject to realtime CCP surveillance. Apple's iCloud operations in China (required under Chinese law for Chinese users) are in CCP-controlled datacenters. https://www.nytimes.com/2021/05/17/technology/apple-china-ce... Then they did it again in the USA, preserving a backdoor in the end-to-end crypto of iMessage for the…

> If you are large enough, the laws don't apply to the government's strong-arm treatment of you. They have all the machine guns, you have none.

Interestingly this also works for small fish: If you are too small, you can get by without sticking to the rules because you won't be on the governments radar.

Re: Tell HN: Razorpay a YC company shared donor data under a Section 91 order

#32

Post by 0xmohit » Wed, Jul 06, 2022, 1:09 PM UTC

In UP, India, a Muslim restaurant owner was arrested because the non-veg food he wrapped with old newspapers had photos of Hindu gods and goddesses.

https://thewire.in/rights/up-man-arrested-for-wrapping-chick...

Re: Tell HN: Razorpay a YC company shared donor data under a Section 91 order

#33

Post by yrgulation » Wed, Jul 06, 2022, 1:10 PM UTC

A shame that corrupt and poor countries are not protecting their startups. Doesn't the police and government in India understand that such abuse will steer away even more investment?

Re: Tell HN: Razorpay a YC company shared donor data under a Section 91 order

#34

Post by thway_nohitler » Wed, Jul 06, 2022, 1:11 PM UTC

hans1729 wrote: post #29

thway_nohitler wrote: post #27

This is very sad to see, and makes me really worry about the people who got their names handed to the police. The current jingoistic BJP regime is doing all sorts of authoratarian things in India, like demolishing housing for merely taking part in protests [0]. They have also used facial recognition techniques to identify mere protesters and punish them severely [1]. They put a doctor in jail for saving lives of kids…

fyi, I get a `page not found` for [3].

Fixed, thanks.

Re: Tell HN: Razorpay a YC company shared donor data under a Section 91 order

#35

Post by shaan7 » Wed, Jul 06, 2022, 1:11 PM UTC

sneak wrote: post #14

rg111 wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I do not know too much about these. But, couldn't they fight it in court?

Hard to make it in to court with dozens of broken bones.

And not much point after you data has _already_ been shared.

Re: Tell HN: Razorpay a YC company shared donor data under a Section 91 order

#36

Post by 0xmohit » Wed, Jul 06, 2022, 1:12 PM UTC

ethbr0 wrote: post #28

RicoElectrico wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

India is weird. It's not really called authoritarian (rankings don't classify it as such), but there are many similar stories of government dysfunction and overreach. Maybe someone else has a word for them?

A lack of rule of law? https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rule_of_law

Not quite. Just that the ruler is the law.

Re: Tell HN: Razorpay a YC company shared donor data under a Section 91 order

#37

Post by ziddoap » Wed, Jul 06, 2022, 1:14 PM UTC

navigate8310 wrote: post #25

ushakov wrote: post #2

current year has brought a lot of public embarrassment for YC

Care to explain, how is this related to the topic in discussion?

>"Razorpay, a YC company shared [...]"

Re: Tell HN: Razorpay a YC company shared donor data under a Section 91 order

#38

Post by gruez » Wed, Jul 06, 2022, 1:18 PM UTC

dragonwriter wrote: post #23

anovikov wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And this is billed as "world's largest democracy". Wtf is the bullshit we are made to believe? Why don't we just stop pretending and relabel most "democratic" countries as just "pro-Westnern"?

> And this is billed as "world's largest democracy". Wtf is the bullshit we are made to believe? Why don't we just stop pretending and relabel most "democratic" countries as just "pro-Westnern"? India is not pro-Western, and none of those things upthread are inconsistent with democracy. They are illiberal, perhaps, but not all democracy is liberal democracy.

>none of those things upthread are inconsistent with democracy. They are illiberal, perhaps, but not all democracy is liberal democracy.

This line of reasoning feels like a motte and bailey to me. When that fact is being trotted out by supporters it's almost always a comparison to liberal democracies. I doubt when Indians say "we're the largest democracy" they're comparing themselves to russia.

Re: Tell HN: Razorpay a YC company shared donor data under a Section 91 order

#39

Post by kanduri » Wed, Jul 06, 2022, 1:18 PM UTC

RicoElectrico wrote: post #18

ghoomketu wrote: post #4

While I have no sympathy for razorpay but I'd just like to point out that laws in India are much more heavy handed than a country like US. People are thrown in jail for social media posts and sometimes just for liking a social media post(1) Twitter has been having a very hard time operating in India too(2) and routinely censoring stuff so while IANAL just remember that things are very different in different parts of…

India is weird. It's not really called authoritarian (rankings don't classify it as such), but there are many similar stories of government dysfunction and overreach. Maybe someone else has a word for them?

It is an electoral autocracy. Merely having elections doesn't make it "democratic". Certainly not if much of mainstream media is under the ownership of the biggest "donors" of the current ruling disposition.

Alternative crowd sourced media houses such as AltNews, The Wire among others are under real danger as are socio-political activists, union organizers, smaller opposition political parties, etc.

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-india-56393944

Re: Tell HN: Razorpay a YC company shared donor data under a Section 91 order

#40

Post by ramraj07 » Wed, Jul 06, 2022, 1:20 PM UTC

RicoElectrico wrote: post #18

ghoomketu wrote: post #4

While I have no sympathy for razorpay but I'd just like to point out that laws in India are much more heavy handed than a country like US. People are thrown in jail for social media posts and sometimes just for liking a social media post(1) Twitter has been having a very hard time operating in India too(2) and routinely censoring stuff so while IANAL just remember that things are very different in different parts of…

India is weird. It's not really called authoritarian (rankings don't classify it as such), but there are many similar stories of government dysfunction and overreach. Maybe someone else has a word for them?

Heres the interesting thing though. A majority of Indian citizens would agree with this overreach. If the majority agrees with heavy handed tactics and they are enforced by elected officials with at least reasonably fair elections then is it right to call it an autocracy?

I don’t agree with any of this of course but it is unfortunate reality here.