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US newspapers are deleting old crime stories, offering subjects a 'clean slate'

theguardian.com

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Re: US newspapers are deleting old crime stories, offering subjects a 'clean slate'

#291

Post by throw_m239339 »

evujumenuk wrote: post #37

I understand this is the general policy in a few places, like Germany. The general idea seems to be that it is more beneficial to a society if criminals are given a viable avenue to lead non-criminal lives again, with the alternative being people going "ah fuck it, I guess I'm a criminal now". I'm surprised at this concept spreading in the US, since the system would generally benefit from having perpetual perpetrator…

There is need for a middle ground between privacy and the safety of the community. In my country, a lot of horrible crimes could have been avoided if the repeated criminal's past crimes were something people could at the least be aware of, one way or another. I'm talking about murders and sex crimes.

Re: US newspapers are deleting old crime stories, offering subjects a 'clean slate'

#292

Post by Dylan16807 »

engineer_22 wrote: post #280
_DeadFred_ wrote: post #263

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The US used to believe in second chances. Now it believes in maximum retribution. Unless you are big business. Then not only will you get a second chance, but the government will fund it.

I don't believe that's true

You need to be more specific about which parts are wrong and in what way. They made a claim about the past, a claim about the present, and a couple claims about businesses. I have no idea which ones you're reacting to.

Re: US newspapers are deleting old crime stories, offering subjects a 'clean slate'

#293

Post by matheusmoreira »

impossiblefork wrote: post #209
evujumenuk wrote: post #37

I understand this is the general policy in a few places, like Germany. The general idea seems to be that it is more beneficial to a society if criminals are given a viable avenue to lead non-criminal lives again, with the alternative being people going "ah fuck it, I guess I'm a criminal now". I'm surprised at this concept spreading in the US, since the system would generally benefit from having perpetual perpetrator…

There are enormous problems with this kind of thing though, especially when for example, a murderer is part of the establishment or is cuddled by the big established entities. There was a guy who was a motor journalist for a major Swedish newspaper (Dagens Nyheter) who stabbed a man to death while his friends prevented the man's escape, and you basically don't get to hear about. It's even been removed from the journa…

> I think truth is much more important

The truth is the most important thing there is. The problem is newspapers are so far removed from the truth it's not even funny. Journalism and truth do not even belong in the same sentence.

Especially today where they engage in shameless rage baiting for engagement and therefore have every incentive in the world to defame someone who might very well turn out to be innocent.

Even the most tyrannical court in the world cannot repair a destroyed reputation. It takes a lifetime to build and seconds to destroy.

Journalists should not be condemning anyone before proper judgement is rendered. Courts staffed by fallible and corruptible human beings are enough of a necessary evil. We really don't need journalists profiting handsomely off of the court of public opinion.

Re: US newspapers are deleting old crime stories, offering subjects a 'clean slate'

#294

Post by Ferret7446 »

bb88 wrote: post #177

IRL I knew someone who was charged with child sexual abuse. He went to prison awaiting trial, but the prosecution dropped the charges before it got there. He was released and went about his life. Meanwhile his mug shot photo in the local paper was the number one google search result for his name. And then it reached syndication for other news sites as well. Ideally those news paper articles should be updated to say t…

I think libel laws should be updated, so entities are compelled to correct the record when requested. News media have gotten away with publishing "well we thought it was true at the time" (or "we didn't say it, we said someone else said it") for too long.

Re: US newspapers are deleting old crime stories, offering subjects a 'clean slate'

#295

Post by wizzwizz4 »

impossiblefork wrote: post #251
like_any_other wrote: post #244

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What is this journalist's name? I couldn't find any information on this, but I don't have much to go on - Dagens Nyheter being a newspaper means "Dagens Nyheter murder" surfaces a lot of results of the newspaper reporting on murders.

Jacques Wallner.

I've found this claim online in only four places. Three are the "Alternative for Sweden" website, Samnytt, and Fria Tider. None are reliable sources (one's a political party of bigots, one's a tabloid that's been "sued multiple times for libel", and the third "anses ha ett uppenbart rasistiskt, främlingsfientligt och islamofobiskt innehåll" (quotations from Wikipedia)). I wrote this, before I looked up the names of the websites:

> I don't know enough Swedish to say for sure, but the language feels tabloidy, and there are passages with quite similar sentence constructions in articles purportedly written four-or-more years apart – so this might be one story that was adapted / plagiarised.

The fourth is https://svenskamordfall.se/stockholm-1980-1989/, which I can't identify the provenance of, but doesn't cite any source for its claim. The Swedish Wikipedia article has some kind of edit war, but the edits are all redacted, so I can't see what the edit war is about. (The revert comments look like "Tar bort icke källbelagt påstående.", so maybe it's about this.)

I'm not wholly sure that this story is true: it could be a smear put out by this journalist's enemies. I see little reason to believe there was even such a trial, unless someone can find court records.

Re: US newspapers are deleting old crime stories, offering subjects a 'clean slate'

#297

Post by Something1234 »

vldmrs wrote: post #200

I have a good story related to the topic of discussion :) I am the author of one site - a dictionary of the English language, which, in addition to the definition of a word from several dictionaries, shows the use of words in different contexts. One of the contexts is news - so for example for the word "window" it shows several news headlines containing the word "window". So, about 10 years ago, I received a very rud…

What is a short verse?

Re: US newspapers are deleting old crime stories, offering subjects a 'clean slate'

#298

Post by zarzavat »

MattGaiser wrote: post #281
FpUser wrote: post #165

This whole criminal record piece of shit is a crime on its own. I believe that records of people who served their time or just have been arrested/carded and then let free must be sealed and not accessible to general employers. Some obvious exceptions can apply but generally people should not be penalized for what they've been penalized already.

Employers would need then to not be liable for the actions of their employees.

They are externalizing that liability on to the rest of society then. It's obviously in everybody's interests that convicted criminals can get jobs outside of crime.

Re: US newspapers are deleting old crime stories, offering subjects a 'clean slate'

#299

Post by recursivecaveat »

BurningFrog wrote: post #262
bdangubic wrote: post #215

Earlier quoted context omitted.

rebuttals are never read by anyone. there are numerous examples of this like in our modern age a completely bogus story will “go viral” and will be shared / read by millions and millions while a retraction will go completely unnoticed. even more serious, bogus scientific studies like the one that started the whole “vaccines cause autism” while fully disputed cannot be undone with a retraction/rebuttal

In my imagined system, the rebuttal/comment is displayed right next to the original story.

Unfortunately so much information is spread through half-remembered tweets of quotes from screenshots of tumblr posts, a lot of people will never see the original story to begin with. Sometimes I feel like I have to pull people's teeth to get straight talk and links out of people making serious accusations instead of indirect references.

Re: US newspapers are deleting old crime stories, offering subjects a 'clean slate'

#300

Post by cogman10 »

Ferret7446 wrote: post #294
bb88 wrote: post #177

IRL I knew someone who was charged with child sexual abuse. He went to prison awaiting trial, but the prosecution dropped the charges before it got there. He was released and went about his life. Meanwhile his mug shot photo in the local paper was the number one google search result for his name. And then it reached syndication for other news sites as well. Ideally those news paper articles should be updated to say t…

I think libel laws should be updated, so entities are compelled to correct the record when requested. News media have gotten away with publishing "well we thought it was true at the time" (or "we didn't say it, we said someone else said it") for too long.

Publishing the name of a suspect should generally not be tolerated. Particularly in the case of mass shootings or general terrorism.

Unless the person is a politician or an active danger, no good comes from publishing their name. In the case they are guilty, you are giving notoriety which encourages copycats. In the case they are innocent, you've seriously harmed the reputation of an innocent person.

The only reason I'd make a carve out for politicians is because well connected politicians have a way of wiggling out of responsibility and electing someone that may spend the next two years behind bars is generally worse for the public they'd represent.

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