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EU shoots for €10B ‘industrial cloud’ to rival US

politico.eu

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Re: EU shoots for €10B ‘industrial cloud’ to rival US

#281

Post by durnygbur »

throwaway7281 wrote: post #274
throw0101a wrote: post #200

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The recent COVID-App is a prime example of that. SAP plus German Telekom, neither of which is known for innovation, grab a 60M plus deal to develop a single app. Meanwhile in Canada Shopify and Blackberry got together and helped the federal Canadian Digital Service in coding up an app, with the code available on GitHub: * https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/COVID_Alert * https://www.covidshield.app * https://github.com/C…

Yes, imagine SAP and Telekom would have said: see, we are so profitable and rich beyond our means by extracting value from our economy each and every day, we want to give something back and build this app for free. What kind of ad this would have been. So they just come across as greedy, corrupt bastard - which probably has the positive side of being very much closer to the truth.

They like money, what you're going to do? BTW Enjoy your 50Mbs copper DSL connection.

Re: EU shoots for €10B ‘industrial cloud’ to rival US

#282

Post by juskrey »

kazen44 wrote: post #275
juskrey wrote: post #10

This smells a bit Soviet. Instead of allowing small businesses to breathe more freely, take more risk and grow to US size companies (in 3x larger internal market!) they try to build a top down copy using an army of grant and procurement funds eaters.. despicable.

this is no way comparable to the soviet command economy system. For one, the EU is not an authoritarian state with absolute power over every facet of life. Also, it is not legally the owner of all assets in it's territory. In no way comparable.

They (EU bureaucrats) may not own everything but have enough power and money to corrupt natural processes or create top-down toxic abominations absolutely in the same way.

Re: EU shoots for €10B ‘industrial cloud’ to rival US

#283

Post by user5994461 »

juskrey wrote: post #276
user5994461 wrote: post #269

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I highly recommend AGAINST Hetzner. Tried to use it earlier this year. Opened an account to host a new project. Went to login the next week to create the instances and launch the projects. Couldn't login because the Hetzner console was broken for 2 days. Yes you heard right, everything was broken and unusable for 2 days. Imagine the AWS console down for 2 days for comparison, that doesn't happen. Few days later when…

They have also answered me on twitter and email. All within several hours or less. But anyway, even if such terrible situation really happened, two weeks? I would have changed provider the next day. Not counting the fact I duplicate critical production deployments and replication on two providers always.

I've used many cloud providers over the decade. It's not uncommon to lose a week to fully open an account, going through some checks and verification with support. I was expecting Hetzner to resolve the issue a couple days after contacting them, just like AWS always responds after exactly 2 days when I send them a request.

Re: EU shoots for €10B ‘industrial cloud’ to rival US

#284

Post by bserge »

LargoLasskhyfv wrote: post #271
bserge wrote: post #261

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I really hope that works for already functioning small business, because I did write and apply everywhere I could. I have a British friend who would work with me on this idea of an appliance reuse/recycling factory in NRW (because it's the closest state to the best suppliers from FR/DE/BE/NL). We've done the research, there's little competition and we could be profitable within a year. To summarize the idea: take bro…

I'm not sure about that. It seems to work for refurbished computers, which are end of lease. For general appliances I doubt it, because not energy efficient enough, liability, warranty and so on. Of course common sense would say refurbishing is better for the environment, but common sense? EU? Anyways, I wish you luck/success.

Computers are actually the more competitive electronics. Probably because they're easy to acquire, refurbish and transport.

Refurbished home appliances like washers/fridges/dryers/dishwashers/ovens are a good product to sell, there are lots of small shops that buy dozens or hundreds of them for resale, and of course, lots of individuals furnishing their own place.

Energy efficiency for them is not going up anytime soon, they've been stuck in the same ratings for more than a decade. They're simply as efficient as possible already.

Liability and warranty would be handled by the resellers, and if agreed, by us. Mostly by return and replacement, but it could be feasible to create an on-site repair service. We can provide the necessary parts, too.

The thing is, a properly fixed appliance will last just as long as a new one. In fact, the failure rate on used electronics can often be lower - newer models that use a new internal design fail more than older, "proven" appliances. The saving grace for them are the warranty and return policies.

Customers will still give 4-5 stars even if their first purchase was a dud, but it was swiftly replaced with another one. That always surprises me, btw. It's like, "oh my new Indesit fridge was DOA, but they replaced it the next day. 5 stars."

Anyway, a big downside is that transportation costs are rather high. And they can only be loaded by forklifts with special attachments, or several people at the same time.

However, the more thoroughly they're checked, repaired and cleaned, the fewer returns, the less money spent on transportation.

Re: EU shoots for €10B ‘industrial cloud’ to rival US

#285

Post by durnygbur »

read_if_gay_ wrote: post #279
umvi wrote: post #252

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What's the point of having social safety nets if you can't exercise them taking risks? Seems like a crying shame.

It’s like the safety net is not just below you, but also above.

It's like the nets are all over you except in place where they'd prevent you from falling down.

Re: EU shoots for €10B ‘industrial cloud’ to rival US

#286

Post by ChuckNorris89 »

read_if_gay_ wrote: post #243
ChuckNorris89 wrote: post #222

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wish I could upvote you more. This is what I noticed in Germany as well. The government keeps tooting their own horn on how in every statistic they're the best in Europe and the media parrots that while the younger generations just takes it for granted and doesn't bother questioning the poor decisions the government makes while they spend the public tax money like drunken sailors because hey, "we're Europe's no. 1,…

I agree that the waste of taxpayer money in Germany is beyond comprehension (while they do take utmost care when it comes to taxing you) and as a young German myself I also agree that many young people just don't question the media, if they get involved in politics at all. But I also know many who do and they've mostly just given up on the country. Because emigration aside, what are you going to do?

>Because emigration aside, what are you going to do?

Maybe vote the corrupt leeches out?

Re: EU shoots for €10B ‘industrial cloud’ to rival US

#287

Post by juskrey »

user5994461 wrote: post #283
juskrey wrote: post #276

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They have also answered me on twitter and email. All within several hours or less. But anyway, even if such terrible situation really happened, two weeks? I would have changed provider the next day. Not counting the fact I duplicate critical production deployments and replication on two providers always.

I've used many cloud providers over the decade. It's not uncommon to lose a week to fully open an account, going through some checks and verification with support. I was expecting Hetzner to resolve the issue a couple days after contacting them, just like AWS always responds after exactly 2 days when I send them a request.

Indeed, some checks on some providers are strange towards some people. E.g. I can't open an account on Linode no matter what, and zero feedback.

Re: EU shoots for €10B ‘industrial cloud’ to rival US

#288

Post by LargoLasskhyfv »

WanderPanda wrote: post #22
throwaway7281 wrote: post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The recent COVID-App is a prime example of that. SAP plus German Telekom, neither of which is known for innovation, grab a 60M plus deal to develop a single app. In Italy a startup took over the job for 1/50 of the price and with at least as good or better job. Is the above play a problem for Germany? No. Do you they even understand an problem? I don't think so.

What afraids me is, that here in Germany nobody seems to care anymore. The big numbers are just thrown around and everyone (especially the younger generation) has lost any sense as the media is just cheering along.

Vorbildfunktion https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peanuts or

https://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mannesmann-Prozess

with the golden handshake/parachute, however you may call it.

Re: EU shoots for €10B ‘industrial cloud’ to rival US

#289

Post by reducesuffering »

PunchTornado wrote: post #209
fcantournet wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not a stupid question. First of all, none of the GAFA were actually started as Cloud infrastructure providers. So the question is not why isn't Europe creating big Cloud Infrastructure companies, one could argue that the biggest "pure-player" in Cloud is OVH which is European. If anything it's the (insanely lax and pro-monopoly) American regulatory environment that has the biggest impact on the creation of big C…

It doesn't help that the best engineers work for GAFA because of big salaries. European companies pay smaller salaries compared to the US ones. A good engineer can double his salary by going to the US. Sure, he may see more social issues there because of no safety net, but maybe he doesn't care.

Less of a safety net is more accurate. Medicare, MediCal, Medicaid, Food Stamps, Social Security, public housing, welfare, etc. It’s the majority of US federal government spending.

Re: EU shoots for €10B ‘industrial cloud’ to rival US

#290

Post by Nimitz14 »

user5994461 wrote: post #245
PunchTornado wrote: post #209

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It doesn't help that the best engineers work for GAFA because of big salaries. European companies pay smaller salaries compared to the US ones. A good engineer can double his salary by going to the US. Sure, he may see more social issues there because of no safety net, but maybe he doesn't care.

Salaries are irrelevant since it's close to impossible for an European worker to move to the US, work visas are incredibly difficult to get and even if you manage to get one you don't have the same careers prospects as a native. edited: reworded to "close to impossible"

??? This is false. Look at the top researchers in US companies and universities and a massive share is from Europe.
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