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U.S. Files Criminal Charges Against Theranos’s Elizabeth Holmes, Ramesh Balwani

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Re: U.S. Files Criminal Charges Against Theranos’s Elizabeth Holmes, Ramesh Balwani

#281

Post by ShabbosGoy »

pharrington wrote: post #261
api wrote: post #185

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wow. That is by far the most realistic and rational hypothesis for this phenomenon I've heard. It's simple, elegant, and seems testable. Thanks! I think this may also offer some explanation for the appeal of the utterly absurd, like flat Earth or galactic emperor Xenu. Its supernormally ridiculous, which invokes a sense of fascination. In any case if this is true I think this effect is being weaponized today to an un…

High profile sociopaths are extreme outliers, as most sociopaths burn through their social connections well before becoming competent enough at social manipulation and finding enough people that are well-off enough to maintain a parasitic life. Also as a side note, within Scientology you don't actually learn about the Xenu shit until you're way too deep, financially and/or time commitment-wise, to pull out.

> Also as a side note, within Scientology you don't actually learn about the Xenu shit until you're way too deep, financially and/or time commitment-wise, to pull out.

It seems they’ve taken a page out of Masonry or mystery religions. Only higher level “initiates” receive the real wisdom.

The question is, are the high level initiates plain psychopaths?

Or are they just addicted to the free pussy (or dick), drugs, and money that comes with forcing others to join the cult?

Re: U.S. Files Criminal Charges Against Theranos’s Elizabeth Holmes, Ramesh Balwani

#282

Post by victor9000 »

riantogo wrote: post #19

For your Friday drive home here is the recent Jason Calacanis interview of the WSJ reporter who broke the story. Great listen. https://itunes.apple.com/us/podcast/this-week-in-startups-au...

Same episode, but it doesn't require itunes:

https://www.stitcher.com/podcast/this-week-in-startups-audio...

Re: U.S. Files Criminal Charges Against Theranos’s Elizabeth Holmes, Ramesh Balwani

#283

Post by Animats »

maxxxxx wrote: post #6

Does anybody know if Theranos got started with at least an idea how to accomplish what they wanted to do? From what I have heard in interviews they started with the thought "Doing xxx would be super useful" but didn't have an approach for accomplishing this but instead took in money and tried to figure it out. It's like me saying "An antimatter drive would revolutionize space exploration" and starting to collect mone…

Abbott sells microfluidic hand-held blood test machines right now.[1] "Just two drops of blood". These have been around since 2006. So it's possible to do this.

[1] https://www.pointofcare.abbott/us/en/offerings/istat/istat-h...

Re: U.S. Files Criminal Charges Against Theranos’s Elizabeth Holmes, Ramesh Balwani

#284

Post by sjg007 »

yourapostasy wrote: post #232
icelancer wrote: post #172

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>> The short answer is her Jobs-like "reality distortion field" -- she was exceedingly good at convincing non-scientists that their science worked. This confuses a lot of people (not saying you are one of them), but this is really common in intelligent non-experts. People vastly overestimate how intelligent they are when they place value on their intelligence; in other words, they like thinking they are smart. When t…

> ...they have false confidence about areas they have zero expertise in, purely because they feel they can figure it out. The antidote to this effect: pick any object around you, and set out to make it yourself from scratch. Or just set out to make the precursors. An object as prosaic as say, a window. A lot of people who suffer from this effect dismissively wave away such a challenge, saying in more words that it's…

Dirty jobs man.

Re: U.S. Files Criminal Charges Against Theranos’s Elizabeth Holmes, Ramesh Balwani

#285

Post by learc83 »

grigjd3 wrote: post #225
gwicks56 wrote: post #215

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's why, when you read the memoirs of conmen, they always say educated, intelligent people are the easiest to rip off.

Funny, the PhD taught me to keep what I say fairly limited. On the other hand, I find generalists will say all kinds of crap that "sounds true" but they have at best a weak theory and a couple of anecdotes.

You seem to be making an argument for a weak theory with a couple of anecdotes.

Re: U.S. Files Criminal Charges Against Theranos’s Elizabeth Holmes, Ramesh Balwani

#286

Post by mikeryan »

the_narrator wrote: post #213
URSpider94 wrote: post #207

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the argument is that stealing $1 million from a billionaire could be considered ethically less bad than stealing $10,000 from someone who is $50,000 in debt due to medical bills. The second theft will have much more impact on the victim than the first.

> The second theft will have much more impact on the victim than the first. That hardly makes it OK though, Are you saying that the first case doesn't deserve the same punishment as the second?

I can’t speak for anyone else but Shkreli was convicted for Securities fraud, Holmes charged wire fraud. The court cases are pretty much moot. They will likely have similar outcomes.

Morally and Ethically however I’d consider Shkreli guilty of far more.

Re: U.S. Files Criminal Charges Against Theranos’s Elizabeth Holmes, Ramesh Balwani

#287

Post by hansthehorse »

mhneu wrote: post #255
dreamcompiler wrote: post #166

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't know about Holmes (other than having read Carreyrou's book) but I've been around pathological, charismatic narcissists enough to be as fascinated as you at their ability to lie to the face of very accomplished people and be completely believed. It's almost like executives need a training course in spotting and dealing with them.

The old quote “The hardest thing to fake is sincerity”.

Or - the easiest person to fool is yourself.

Re: U.S. Files Criminal Charges Against Theranos’s Elizabeth Holmes, Ramesh Balwani

#288

Post by sjg007 »

pmiller2 wrote: post #218
Kluny wrote: post #170

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Psychopaths are parasites - one could make the argument that most of human culture, including our marriage traditions, religions, moral codes of conduct, sense of humor, and even fashion, are evolutionary attempts to thwart them.

How would that argument go? Is it just that setting up social rules makes it easy to spot when people don’t follow them?

Yes. And using a community to contain them or alert you.

Re: U.S. Files Criminal Charges Against Theranos’s Elizabeth Holmes, Ramesh Balwani

#289

Post by hawkice »

jason_slack wrote: post #247
hawkice wrote: post #246

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Steve Jobs definitely wasn't engaged in criminal fraud, so the prosecutor will definitely be trying to demonstrate she wasn't "the next Steve Jobs". Given what we know we should hear that prosecutors' argument.

Why the down vote, she is referred to as the next Steve Jobs: https://mashable.com/2018/03/14/elizabeth-holmes-theranos-se...

Because being popular doesn't make you above the law. The comment is at best irrelevant, at worse morally noxious.

Re: U.S. Files Criminal Charges Against Theranos’s Elizabeth Holmes, Ramesh Balwani

#290

Post by joejerryronnie »

puzzle wrote: post #164
maxxxxx wrote: post #87

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The only one that comes to mind is Magic Leap. They could blow up like Theranos.

As a data point, GV decided twice not to invest in Theranos, due to lack of transparency, a peculiar board mix and a sketchy experience in the field. They actually sent someone to a Walgreens. Later they happily poured lots of millions into Magic Leap.

See, even GV can be duped into idiotic investments. Theranos couldn't trick them but Magic Leap sure did!
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