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Tesla created secret team to suppress driving range complaints (2023)

reuters.com

261–270 of 287 posts

Re: Tesla created secret team to suppress driving range complaints (2023)

#262
post #199

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The "Ministry of Truth" in this case is a bad analogy though, since in the story, its purpose was to redefine what is the truth according to state up to the point of forcing people ignore the proof that they see in front of their eyes through torture.

I'm now picturing a customer support that can send henchmen to convince you that, "no, we never advertised 500m of autonomy, and your range did not drop unexpectedly while you were driving, and anyway the car was fully self-driving itself into that tree - we have logs and data and signed ToC to prove ourselves, now please sit down on this chair so we can strap you and use this big red hammer to protect your free spee…

Yeah, there's a video going around where a dealership is working with Tesla to repair a car battery, but Tesla says the car has structural damage and is therefore classified as salvage, so the repair will cost $12,000+.

The guy says "Salvage is different from having structural damage, I have proof here that it's not salvage". Tesla informs the man that "according to Tesla, it's salvage, and they can't provide any more details about anything, if you want more you have to go through Tesla Legal"

So when it comes to Tesla, it's salvage if they says so, despite any other records, and if you don't like it, you can sue.

Re: Tesla created secret team to suppress driving range complaints (2023)

#263
post #196
post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I hear you, but during my testing I’ve been driving like a grandma , and I usually drive tame enough to exceed Gas EPA estimates by 15%, so I was really shocked to have terrible EV range. In my 270 mile test I was under 60 for 85% of the trip, and never over 75

270, wow. You could just ignore the estimate number, or go back to gas. My “tests” haha are more like 2,500 - 3,500 miles with almost ten of these under my belt and I’m a happy camper, and I don’t have to go slow but then I chose the brand with the good charging network, and I follow my formula and I own (and embrace) the extra burning of range because it’s my choice to drive hard. Aerodynamic drag increases with the…

and are you getting to the bottom 20% of the battery? The estimates at the top half of the battery seem phony

Re: Tesla created secret team to suppress driving range complaints (2023)

#264
post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Where's the sacrifice? Just charge it to 100% before you leave for a 200+ mile trip, there's even a setting in your app to make that happen automatically (it'll start charging at e.g. 2am or whatever is needed for your departure time). Did you gas up your car every time you drove back from work? No, right? So why complain that the car doesn't sit at 100% all the time in your garage? Seems like a silly complaint to me…

When my tank gets 10% on my ICE, I fill a full tank.

That's nice. It's just so weird to me that Musk's adventures in authoritarian nutjobbery are causing us to revisit long dead nonsense FUD arguments about EVs that have been clearly disproven in the market for like a decade now.

I mean, seriously? We're doing this?

Re: Tesla created secret team to suppress driving range complaints (2023)

#265
post #227

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Seems I angered some VW PR people

Sounds like the text was written by my German native speaker colleague and then translated to English. But the tool is fine. The range drops dramatically in winter on the autobahn. -1% or more per minute of driving. Not thinkable with petrol car.

> Sounds like the text was written by my German native speaker colleague and then translated to English.

That's what I was hinting at, being a German native speaker myself. :)

Re: Tesla created secret team to suppress driving range complaints (2023)

#266

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Electric cars being much, much heavier than petrol cars do have a disadvantage going uphill. I'd still reckon that range estimates should ignore these extreme edge cases, though.

> much, much heavier Stop that. 10 - 15% doesn’t constitute “much, much”.

IMO it does, that’s the difference between a sedan and an SUV for a lot of brands.

Re: Tesla created secret team to suppress driving range complaints (2023)

#267

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm sorry but this is a pet peeve of mine: drag force does not scale exponentially with velocity, it scales with the square of velocity. Your point stands, of course.

Yes, you’re right. I’ve gotten use to saying this incorrectly because most people aren’t trained on (or at least don’t remember) the difference between various types of growth functions. Exponential registers much more clearly in everyday conversation.

I also use the word exponential to refer to any curve that trends upwards

Re: Tesla created secret team to suppress driving range complaints (2023)

#268

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> they regularly drive 100mph average You don't drive 100mph average on German motorways. Especially with the trucks not giving a damn and forcing themselves through to the left lane to pass their colleagues driving 2 kph slower, arriving traffic be damned.

The reality of driving in Germany is that a lot of federal states have maximum speeds on the highway now. And thanks to years of neglect there is a lot of road construction everywhere in the country which means reduced speeds. Speeds are also reduced around cities, around major junctions. And that's usually also where the traffic jams are. A journey from Berlin to my parents in the Netherlands (525km) would probably…

It's a norm to drive 160km/h in Poland. Pretty much everywhere on the A/S roads: https://ssc.siskom.waw.pl/.

Re: Tesla created secret team to suppress driving range complaints (2023)

#269

I have a model 3 (from 2023), that is rated 270 miles. I can get at max 120 miles, more like 90 miles from it. My drive to work involves going steeply uphill, not very cold. The only reason I don’t care is I have free office charging. If I didn’t I would be pissed by the range I observe. Also Tesla servicing is famously bad, and the way the employees treat service requests (as described in the article) explains a lot

Slightly more nuanced: the "range"/battery level listed constantly is always bunk. When I enter a destination the final battery level is very accurate. This counts in cold weather or hot, with terrain effects or not. Sometimes even weather. It's quite good and I imagine there's some data driven process from past performance of the vehicle. So, if you plan to test drive a Tesla, evaluate its range this way. If you're…

So Tesla could show a much more accurate value for the overall range but chooses not to.

Re: Tesla created secret team to suppress driving range complaints (2023)

#270

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If I’m not mistaken some or all also have battery heaters that consume a lot of energy.

With coolant loops, the heat produced by the inverter and motor is sufficient for battery heating in almost all climates and driving conditions.

But the battery also needs to be heated when you aren't driving is the issue, I thought.
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