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Arrest of Pavel Durov, Telegram CEO, charges of terrorism, fraud, child porn

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Re: Arrest of Pavel Durov, Telegram CEO, charges of terrorism, fraud, child porn

#261

Post by StrLght »

whimsicalism wrote: post #224
jstummbillig wrote: post #150

Earlier quoted context omitted.

IANAL and not that familiar with the legal situation, but if we assume that running a platform of this type requires you, by law, to moderate such a platform and he fails to do that, idk what we are talking about. Yes, he would clearly be breaking the law. Why would that not get prosecuted in the completely normal, boring way that I would hope all law breaking will eventually be prosecuted? If you are alleging that t…

i don't think that platform providers of encrypted messaging should be required to ensure that none of the images being sent contain CP.

You're missing the key part: Telegram doesn’t have E2EE enabled by default. Group chats and channels aren’t encrypted at all.

The only E2EE in Telegram is called "secret chats" and they're 1-on-1.

Re: Arrest of Pavel Durov, Telegram CEO, charges of terrorism, fraud, child porn

#262

Post by mtlmtlmtlmtl »

kemayo wrote: post #251
mtlmtlmtlmtl wrote: post #162

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've actually given up trying to post on Reddit for this reason. Whenever I've tried to join in on a discussion in some subreddit that's relevant(eg r/chess) my post has been autoremoved by a bot because my karma is too low or my account is "too new". Well how can I get any karma if all my posts are deleted?

Comment in subreddits without those restrictions for a bit. E.g. this list: https://www.reddit.com/r/NewToReddit/wiki/index/newusersubs/ I can see how it's frustrating, but the communities you're trying to post in are essentially offloading their moderation burden onto the big popular subreddits with low requirements -- if you can prove you're capable of posting there without getting downvoted into oblivion, you're p…

That's silly. I gotta go shitpost in subreddits I have no interest in as some sort of bizarre rite of passage? I'd rather just not use the site at that point.

Re: Arrest of Pavel Durov, Telegram CEO, charges of terrorism, fraud, child porn

#263

Post by wetpaws »

pshirshov wrote: post #245

My opinion would be extremely unpopular, but: 1) The guy was marketing an open-text messenger as an e2ee messenger 2) Because of (1) he was able to moderate it and help law enforcement with locating criminals but he was not cooperating 3) He was extremely cooperative with Russian "law enforcement", as multiple deanonymised activists with leaked chats, contact lists and location history found out So, a hypocrite got w…

[dead]

Re: Arrest of Pavel Durov, Telegram CEO, charges of terrorism, fraud, child porn

#264

Post by jeroenhd »

loceng wrote: post #137
jeroenhd wrote: post #124

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Dotcom got extradited (which was declared legal much later). Durov landed in a country that had an arrest warrant out for him. I hope his situation isn't similar to Dotcom's, as Dotcom was shown to be complicit in the crimes he was being persecuted for. Convicting the megaupload people would've been a LOT harder if they hadn't been uploading and curating illegal content on their platform themselves. As a service prov…

From my understanding the arrest warrant only was created while he was en route; sneaky sneaky..

According to the more detailed news sources I can find about this, it seems he knew the French were looking for him. I don't know if he knew about the contents of the warrant, but it does seem he knew the authorities were planning to arrest him.

From what I can tell the warrant has been out for longer, but he was arrested when the airport police noticed his name was on a list. There's not a lot of information out there, with neither the French authorities nor Telegram providing any official statements to the media.

Re: Arrest of Pavel Durov, Telegram CEO, charges of terrorism, fraud, child porn

#265

Post by poszlem »

hdbejs wrote: post #158

Many defend Telegram by likening it to a neutral platform, akin to TCP, claiming it merely provides a service without responsibility for the content. However, this comparison fails because TCP is a simple protocol with no ability to control or monitor content, whereas Telegram holds keys for most data and is capable of content moderation. Unlike E2EE platforms like Signal, which cannot comply with requests without br…

FWIW this post is ChatGPT generated at least partially.

Re: Arrest of Pavel Durov, Telegram CEO, charges of terrorism, fraud, child porn

#266

Post by NayamAmarshe »

mlyle wrote: post #202
NayamAmarshe wrote: post #195

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, I don't doubt that it can be improved. I hope it does because Telegram is not a fringe messenger anymore. There can be improvements made to the infrastructure, so that they don't keep facing these issues again and again.

> Yeah, I don't doubt that it can be improved. There was no discussion of whether it can be improved. I was just telling you that it meets the established understanding of the term "effectively plaintext," which you were seeming to disagree with. Have a good rest of your day.

> which you were seeming to disagree with.

Yeah, I would still disagree because everything is effectively plaintext in the end. The only difference is how you derive the key. There are levels of encryption, that is true but I think calling an actual encryption as 'effectively plaintext' is wrong.

> Have a good rest of your day.

Thank you! You too :D

Re: Arrest of Pavel Durov, Telegram CEO, charges of terrorism, fraud, child porn

#267

Post by c0mbonat0r »

jsheard wrote: post #86
saintfrancis wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How does Meta cooperate with the authorities? Isn't Whatsapp supposed to be end-to-end encrypted?

Telegram is for the most part not end-to-end encrypted, one to one chats can be but aren't by default, and groups/channels are never E2EE. That means Telegram is privy to a large amount of the criminal activity happening on their platform but allegedly chooses to turn a blind eye to it, unlike Signal or WhatsApp, who can't see what their users are doing by design. Not to say that deliberately making yourself blind to…

if its not not end-to-end encrypted, what does that mean? whats the method that govts access these messages?

Re: Arrest of Pavel Durov, Telegram CEO, charges of terrorism, fraud, child porn

#268

Post by ineptech »

mazambazz wrote: post #29

This seems like the Kim Dotcom situation again. Why are these service providers being punished for what their users do? Specifically, these service providers? Because Google, Discord, Reddit, etc. all contain some amount of CSAM (and other illegal content), yet I don't see Pichai, Citron, or Huffman getting indicted for anything. Hell, then there's the actual infrastructure providers too. This seems like a slippery s…

> the warrant was issued because of his alleged failure to cooperate with the French authorities.

That would seem to be the key bit. Makes one wonder what level of cooperation is required to not be charged with a slew of the worst crimes imaginable. Is there a French law requiring that messaging providers give up encryption keys that he is known to be in violation of?

Re: Arrest of Pavel Durov, Telegram CEO, charges of terrorism, fraud, child porn

#269

Post by carbotaniuman »

whimsicalism wrote: post #240
dns_snek wrote: post #172

Earlier quoted context omitted.

One of those was @rtnews which is definitely state-sponsored propaganda and remains inaccessible to this day. They cooperated to some degree, but I'll go out on a limb to say that the authorities wanted Telegram to be fully subservient to western government interests.

i should be allowed to watch whatever state propaganda i want, i'm a big boy 15 years ago in the US this would have been uncontroversial

I'm sure the US government would have been real keen on you reading Kremlin news source 40 year ago...

Re: Arrest of Pavel Durov, Telegram CEO, charges of terrorism, fraud, child porn

#270

Post by frankharv »

whimsicalism wrote: post #232
blackeyeblitzar wrote: post #187

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That’s really dark and dystopian

really? we seal warrants in the US all the time - we don't want people who we are trying to apprehend to always know ahead of time we are trying to apprehend them

I found this airplane trickery amusing.

https://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news/son-el-chapo-another-si...

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