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Vaccinated Americans now may go without masks in most places, the CDC said

nytimes.com

261–270 of 925 posts

Re: Vaccinated Americans now may go without masks in most places, the CDC said

#261
post #3

It’s good to give better incentives for people to be vaccinated, as many have urged for some time. I worry this carrot isn’t tied to an adequate stick - the unvaccinated can simply go without a mask regardless of their status. Will this move actually counter our slowing vaccination rates?

> I worry this carrot isn’t tied to an adequate stick

If most of the new cases start to be among the unvaccinated, that could make for a stick.

Re: Vaccinated Americans now may go without masks in most places, the CDC said

#262

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My guess: GP is young and healthy, so the chance of significant harm from COVID is nearly zero, and the vaccines for COVID have significantly worse side effects than pretty much any other vaccines given today. Thus, until today, it was a high-risk low-reward proposition.

The risk and severity of bad effects from COVID exceed the risks and severity of the bad effects from the vaccine across all age categories. It is a low-risk, higher-reward proposition for everyone. And even if all the virus does is fry your sense of smell you're better off with a few days of influenza-like symptoms from the vaccines.

Anecdotally, dozens of people in my social circle (aged 30-50) reported that the worst vaccine side effects were (1) a sore arm and (2) 24-48 hours of sleepy brain fog (even after the second dose). Among first and second degree connections on Facebook, I know of exactly two people who experienced the full gamut of flu-like symptoms, such as fever, chills, and whole-body aches for a day or two. Take this with a grain of salt, but I'd estimate an upper bound of 10% for "moderately unpleasant" side effects among young-ish, moderately healthy individuals.

Re: Vaccinated Americans now may go without masks in most places, the CDC said

#263

Earlier quoted context omitted.

nobody gets hurt if you put the mask on.

Lets wait to see what the economic impacts of this fear culture brings, before announcing there are no casualties.

What would wearing a mask in relatively safe conditions add to the collective trauma of the past year?

Re: Vaccinated Americans now may go without masks in most places, the CDC said

#264

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thank you for noticing this. This is a media blitz, and one may wonder why there are prepared, published stories about CDC guidance that hadn't yet even been published. I'm sure there are many rational reasons for this. One, indeed, is particularly salient.

This is 100% normal. Press is informed under embargo to assure information goes out quickly and widely once the information is ready/ public. Nothing nefarious about it.

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Re: Vaccinated Americans now may go without masks in most places, the CDC said

#265

Earlier quoted context omitted.

“Literally zero downsides” is a bit of an exaggeration, don’t you think? Surely you’ll concede that they make your glasses fog up.

If your glasses fog up from wearing a mask, your mask is ineffective. Get a better mask that actually seals around your face.

Like what kind of mask? In heavy industry or manufacturing environments, I can assure you that nearly all are wearing N95s or surgical masks, and they all cause real issues with safety glasses fogging. It's been a huge problem, alleviated some with the Uvex wipes.

Re: Vaccinated Americans now may go without masks in most places, the CDC said

#266
post #242
post #225

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The NSA and CDC are fundamentally different institutions. It does not make sense to treat them the same any more than it makes sense to treat NASA and the IRS the same...

They are not the same, but they are institutions with a lot of similarities (NSA, CDC, NASA, IRS). They largely receive funding the same way, and are answerable to the same people (congress, White House). There is some similarities to how the heads of these organizations are determined and how the heads of these organizations are fired. In startup speak the organizations have the same VC and share many board members.

Yes both may be subject to some amount of political influence, but one is run by career infectious disease experts and one is run by career spies...

Re: Vaccinated Americans now may go without masks in most places, the CDC said

#267

I wish it was common and expected that those that want to go maskless, wear their vaccination cards around their necks. Not a requirement, but just having it be common enough that if you do, people will know what it means. Here in San Francisco, more than 50% of people are fully vaccinated, but everyone is still wearing masks, even outdoors. I don't think it is just that SF hasn't changed the mandate, it is more abou…

Get a roll of stickers that say you're vaccinated? There's a lot available, and it's not too obtrusive.

Re: Vaccinated Americans now may go without masks in most places, the CDC said

#268

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Some see downsides. There's a reason that in many places in the US it was illegal to wear a mask in public before COVID happened. Most of the time it is to prevent potential law breakers from being anonymous, I think. I don't support it, but I wouldn't be surprised if it comes back someday.

It seems pretty unlikely that someone who is already willing to commit a violent crime would care whether or not he violates a mask law.

Yes, but when it's illegal, it's much easier to quickly identify the law breaker before the trouble starts.

Re: Vaccinated Americans now may go without masks in most places, the CDC said

#269

I think it's worth noting that among the demographics that frequent this site there is ostensibly a deep distrust and skepticism of the American government on matters of surveillance, and law enforcement. Yet simultaneously there is ostensibly a high degree of trust in the motives and competency of the American government when it comes to COVID. There's been multiple threads lately, including one that is on the front…

As a European I'm quite surprised how deep the conspiracy theories and suspicions against the state go in the US. You don't need tp take everything at face value, but to be so suspicious of essential institutions like the CDC seems crazy to me. Except for a vocal but tiny minority there's a lot of trust in the institutions of the EU and (Western) Europe, where citizrns at most worry about incompetence, not malicious manipulation. On the contrary societal trust in the US seems immensely low.

Re: Vaccinated Americans now may go without masks in most places, the CDC said

#270
I hope my thinking on this is overly pessimistic but I think wearing masks is going to be perhaps the biggest lightning rod in America for a while. It’s going to act as a proxy issue for many other sociopolitical and psychological issues that will be channeled into this conflict.

I think the perhaps the best advice is entirely cliche. We are going to need to respect other people’s choices and try to be as patient and kind as we can.

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