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UC Santa Cruz fires 54 grad students who were striking for higher pay

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Re: UC Santa Cruz fires 54 grad students who were striking for higher pay

#261

Post by refurb »

csb6 wrote: post #60
antiterra wrote: post #24

I got filled with righteous internet rage when I read the headline, but then I read the article. The particular strike was implemented by withholding fall grades, which seems to unnecessarily burden students who are to be buried under crushing debt, no? Also, they are apparently unionized and this strike was against the extant agreements. The consequences of not getting a grade can affect a student’s entire career an…

If you read the rest of the article, you would see that the union is alleging that the UC administration was not willing to engage in negotiations to raise compensation for grad students, who were unable to afford their rent payments. It's no wonder a wildcat strike happened. Also, I am saddened by your comment about withholding grades being an unnecessary "burden". That's the point of a strike. What do you think a s…

If you read the rest of the article, you would see that the union is alleging that the UC administration was not willing to engage in negotiations to raise compensation for grad students, who were unable to afford their rent payments. It's no wonder a wildcat strike happened.

The freakin union negotiated on behalf of the grad students and agreed to the contract!

Where was the union when that was happening?

They are playing dumb. They had every opportunity to bring up that issue when the contract was open.

I'm pretty sure what happened was the union decided that the deal was good enough for everyone they represented and threw the grad students under the bus.

Re: UC Santa Cruz fires 54 grad students who were striking for higher pay

#262

Post by epistasis »

cycrutchfield wrote: post #200
gyrgtyn wrote: post #175

Earlier quoted context omitted.

“I’m struggling for basic needs such as toilet paper, buying my son milk,” said Arjona, who pays about $1,700 a month in rent out of the $2,200 she receives

A cursory examination of Craigslist shows that you can easily rent a nice 4 bedroom house for $4000/month in Santa Cruz. Get a couple of roommates to split the rent and you're only paying $1000/month. Perhaps Arjona should consider that she could have more money for living expenses if she was more economical with her housing choices. After all, she was the one who chose to sign a lease for $1700/month on a $2200/mont…

As somebody in Santa Cruz, good ducking luck actually getting that house.

Finding a place off Craig's list is nearly impossible.

Last time I tried to use that (5years ago), the only call-backs I got from about 20 calls were landlords that recognized my name and I had known from other contexts (I've lived here a while). I ended up getting a place through other personal connections. Most local rentals operate on a network of personal connections here, with locals offering friends or other locals a deal to get by in an expensive town. Students never get this treatment, and often don't even get shown rooms.

For a grad student arriving without an extensive network, a room for $1700 isn't too bad.

The university has abandoned these students, and so has the town.

Re: UC Santa Cruz fires 54 grad students who were striking for higher pay

#263

Post by daguava »

valid4life wrote: post #83

I'm an undergrad at UCSC right now and have found the entire strike to be more detrimental to their cause. They've lost so much undergrad support after disrupting a STEM midterm and shutting down campus causing us to miss the classes we have paid for. I even lost my grades last quarter as my TA was fired ( of the 54 ) and he has refused to hand them over post firing. What it has done to the undergraduates is a little…

Wow, your university treated their staff like shit and you're mad that the associated materials are gone. Open up your brain a bit.

Re: UC Santa Cruz fires 54 grad students who were striking for higher pay

#264

Post by sjg007 »

papeda wrote: post #108

There are about 1800 UCSC graduate students [1]. From this 2014-15 UCSC budget report [2] there is a very near 2:1 masters:phd graduation ratio. Assuming there are 2 years of masters students and 6 of PhD at any one time, that makes PhD students 60% of “graduate students”. Let’s make this easy by saying 1000 PhD students (if anything I imagine it’s way less than this — as I understand, monetizing masters students has…

The whole grad school equation is foobar. Universities import foreign labor and they under pay given their monopoly where paid positions exist. They also rely on students obtaining external funding.

Re: UC Santa Cruz fires 54 grad students who were striking for higher pay

#265

Post by yjftsjthsd-h »

unethical_ban wrote: post #238
kova12 wrote: post #233

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Which just underlies the problem with unions: not only they are compulsory institutions that force you into their ranks whether you want it or not, but even those who join them don't get a fair representation and have to strike on their own.

Define "fair representation" And, tell me how not having any union is better for all than an imperfect union.

> tell me how not having any union is better for all than an imperfect union.

Obvious answer: No dues. Not commenting on whether that's a good tradeoff, mind, but it's an answer.

Re: UC Santa Cruz fires 54 grad students who were striking for higher pay

#266

Post by daguava »

readhn wrote: post #218
valid4life wrote: post #83

I'm an undergrad at UCSC right now and have found the entire strike to be more detrimental to their cause. They've lost so much undergrad support after disrupting a STEM midterm and shutting down campus causing us to miss the classes we have paid for. I even lost my grades last quarter as my TA was fired ( of the 54 ) and he has refused to hand them over post firing. What it has done to the undergraduates is a little…

now is not the time to back down. teaching is hard. teaching and doing research is even harder. this whole problem would be solved by everyone grad and undergrads walking out for a few weeks. Throw in a hunger strike in there too. Only a big disruption at this point will get things done. Now is not the time to back down. The School admins will not understand any other language unfortunately.

Teaching needs a large pay-bump. If you only hire the lowest common denominators you're going to get the lowest result. I've seen so many teachers move on to other jobs just because it doesn't have the pay needed for basic living.

Stop calling things like this socialism, futures depend on good education.

Re: UC Santa Cruz fires 54 grad students who were striking for higher pay

#267

Post by epistasis »

refurb wrote: post #260
readhn wrote: post #219

Earlier quoted context omitted.

that little detail, everyone seems to miss...

Does it matter? They asked their union to represent them along with the other UCSC union members (they are a small part of the members). The union did so, and they are held to that contract.

If somebody bargains on your behalf, and you have no way to reject what they bargained for, can you really say that they acted in your behalf at all?

Re: UC Santa Cruz fires 54 grad students who were striking for higher pay

#268

Post by yjftsjthsd-h »

ganoushoreilly wrote: post #29
pkaye wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In college, a professor recommended me for an academic award from industry. It was $1000. So I go to the yearly awards dinner and a month later got a check for $800. Apparently the university takes a 20% as administrative cost!

That's actually low! Most of the Universities we've explored research grants with wanted 45-65% overhead for the university, then another 10-15 for Research organization, with the remainder sorted between the researchers / company. We found it was actually just cheaper to pay for the research ourselves and hire the students directly for part time work than go through the grant process. I sat on a couple school boards…

> and just targeting students / researchers directly.

Sounds like a win-win, yeah? So, sorta happy ending...

Re: UC Santa Cruz fires 54 grad students who were striking for higher pay

#269

Post by Ar-Curunir »

chrisseaton wrote: post #37
rumanator wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unfortunately a PhD is sold as a key step for a well-paying and fulfilling career where you can make a difference. As we live in a society where education is fundamental to success and having a good life, a PhD is considered as the last and most exclusive step in a promising career path. But then the disappointing part is that the system in place is designed to exploit newcomers and place them in an abuse relationshi…

But you don’t have to work for the university while you do your PhD if you don’t want to. I didn’t - I worked for a company instead. Maybe if the university had paid more I’d have worked for it instead.

That’s not an option for most students, especially if you want to have a shot at publishing regularly.

Research is already a full time job.

Re: UC Santa Cruz fires 54 grad students who were striking for higher pay

#270

Post by saagarjha »

cycrutchfield wrote: post #209
saagarjha wrote: post #206

Earlier quoted context omitted.

At my university, graduate student housing is already like this. Graduate students are doing this already.

Great, that's as it should be. At your university, are graduate students able to afford such a living situation on their stipends?

Students at my university started striking four days ago.
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