Driverless semis have started running regular longhaul routes • Hacker News Board

Re: Driverless semis have started running regular longhaul routes

#241

Post by achierius » Sat, May 03, 2025, 2:35 AM UTC

mulmen wrote: post #120

triceratops wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Why do you think a trucker would risk life or even their truck in a highway robbery? That's an armed robbery whereas stealing from a robo-truck is more like breaking and entering. Robberies require the willingness and ability to commit violence. Having a human witness present means more risk of things going wrong, even if they don't intervene. I think all these factors prevent a lot of potential crimes.

These trucks are already covered in cameras. The self driving ones even more. How does this highway robbery even work? You force the autonomous truck to stop, take an angle grinder to the doors, then... unpack all the crates and boxes and hope you find something good that's also small enough to get away with? it just doesn't pass the sniff test for me.

Huh? Why not? That sounds exactly like what I would expect to happen. Show up with a stolen truck (or cover the license plates), track down some truck on a route between cities, pop it open and see what you get. If it's good, pile it in the truck and drive off.

As to why that doesn't happen now? If you try to rob a piloted truck in the middle of nowhere, whether or not you plan on hurting the guy, he's going to fear for his life (why would he trust your good intentions if you're robbing him?) -- and if he fears for his life, there's a good chance he pulls his gun on you. That means you need to come prepared to commit violence and risk him doing the same

Re: Driverless semis have started running regular longhaul routes

#242

Post by analog31 » Sat, May 03, 2025, 2:36 AM UTC

vlan0 wrote: post #177

callc wrote: post #153

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Definitely. Since human lives are at stake, it is fair to have an extremely high bar for safety.

It's an interesting bar to set. And it shows how we're willing to bend that safety bar to allow seniors to drive on the roads despite their clear cognitive disadvantage. Let's look at some raw data. Mind you, we have 100x more data for the human drivers below. ie, billions of miles vs millions for automated drivers. Pop examined Fatal-crash rate All Level‑4 automated‑driving tests in the U.S. 1.5–1.7 per 100 M mi Dri…

Likewise younger drivers, as indicated by insurance rates.

Re: Driverless semis have started running regular longhaul routes

#243

Post by isx726552 » Sat, May 03, 2025, 2:36 AM UTC

throwaway48476 wrote: post #194

isx726552 wrote: post #129

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don’t know why you’re being downvoted. It is absolutely in the cards for the ownership class to send out swarms of drones to kill us all. The best we can hope for is to all end up in permanent slums picking through garbage to survive. One peep of protest a little too loud and suddenly we’ll all be living the same scenario that’s visible all over the “combat footage” portions of the web: you are walking along outdoo…

There's a lot of truth to that however the supply chain for everything today has never been longer or had more intermediaries. It's like a house of cards built ever higher and no one has budgeted anything for resilience. JIT, outsourcing, etc, everything is cheaper at the cost of resilience.

Oh yes I’ve thought of that, but I’m sure they have too. If AI advances to the point where everyone is out of work, then it will have also likely advanced to the point where it can aid in getting around the current supply chain fragilities.

That angle unfortunately just doesn’t give me much hope.

Re: Driverless semis have started running regular longhaul routes

#244

Post by 93po » Sat, May 03, 2025, 2:41 AM UTC

dylan604 wrote: post #202

ortusdux wrote: post #198

Is anyone working on an electric truck system where the battery is on the trailer? Many businesses are constantly rotating the same dry van trailers between hubs. If you charged the trailers at the doc during loading/unloading, the rigs could run 24/7, only stopping to swap trailers.

how are the trailers getting charged? there are a lot more trailers than tractors, and having enough charge capacity for trailers seems like a lot. There are a lot of trailers that are just a frame with wheels for a shipping container.

trailers have to sit at docks to get loaded and unloaded. they can charge then. meanwhile the truck can leave instantly. maybe a two part system of flatbed trailer with battery + cargo container sitting on top that?

Re: Driverless semis have started running regular longhaul routes

#245

Post by [deleted] » Sat, May 03, 2025, 2:42 AM UTC

floxy wrote: post #86

recursivedoubts wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

next level would be to hook these "platoons" together physically and then centralize the propulsion in a super efficient package. And then we could move them off the highways and onto specialized "tracks" that guarantee they don't deviate from the planned routes. speculative, alien technology, admittedly, but some day our scientists will figure it out i bet!

So why aren't trains automated yet? I mean, beside the inter-airport shuttles. Seems like a much more constrained set of parameters to deal with. I'd think this would be a good "first" project to tackle for an AV company, even if the economics of replacing locomotive drivers/engineers weren't super compelling. Is it an insurance thing? Because a train wreck could be much more disastrous and costly? Or is it a union t…

[deleted]

Re: Driverless semis have started running regular longhaul routes

#246

Post by Barbing » Sat, May 03, 2025, 2:43 AM UTC

triceratops wrote: post #83

JumpCrisscross wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> if a human driver is concerned, they can choose not to drive during this period of time Self-driving cars are currently proving safer than manually-piloted ones. There isn’t a good reason to segregate traffic like this. > what would stop a few cars passage in front of the truck and helping themselves to the cargo Why do you think a trucker would risk life or even their truck in a highway robbery?

> Why do you think a trucker would risk life or even their truck in a highway robbery? That's an armed robbery whereas stealing from a robo-truck is more like breaking and entering. Robberies require the willingness and ability to commit violence. Having a human witness present means more risk of things going wrong, even if they don't intervene. I think all these factors prevent a lot of potential crimes.

I was surprised to see a ~2020 photo of a security flyer:

“HVL Do Not Stop List” (High Value Load)

Thus I learned some truck stops in Texas, California, and elsewhere are too dangerous for “L Brands” (Bath & Body Works?) truckers to patronize. Unfortunate the human factor is not a sufficient deterrent, but agree—

A candy store is a less attractive theft target than a vending machine.

Re: Driverless semis have started running regular longhaul routes

#247

Post by encrypted_bird » Sat, May 03, 2025, 2:47 AM UTC

krapp wrote: post #186

encrypted_bird wrote: post #136

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thank you. This is no better than that terribly disingenuous argument that "nobody wants to work". No, we'd love to work. But we also value not starving to death and having some semblance of work-life balance.

>But we also value not starving to death and having some semblance of work-life balance. But the free market has decided you're barely worth the cost to keep alive, much less happy. What are you, some kind of communist?

Democratic socialist actually. I believe markets are fine but that there needs to be strong worker protections. (I know you were joking, but I figured I'd answer honestly anyway. Hehe.)

Re: Driverless semis have started running regular longhaul routes

#248

Post by encrypted_bird » Sat, May 03, 2025, 2:48 AM UTC

dylan604 wrote: post #199

encrypted_bird wrote: post #182

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This doesn't surprise me in the least. It's the same thing with older people claiming moral degeneration with younger generations.

Or every generations' younger crowd that think the olds are senile fools that have no clue about anything today and mainly tolerated and polite to as long as they are in the room, but then immediately make fun of them as soon as they leave. As if there's no wisdom that could be shared from their experience. The folly of youth thinking they are invincible is equal to this so called claiming of moral degeneration.

Yes, that too. I fully agree. Both ends of the age spectrum have valuable contributions; one denigrating the other provides no value.

Re: Driverless semis have started running regular longhaul routes

#249

Post by recursive » Sat, May 03, 2025, 2:50 AM UTC

dylan604 wrote: post #209

recursive wrote: post #175

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How do you feel about the elevator operation industry?

comparing an elevator to a semi-truck and trailer as the same is disingenuous at best, and pointless at worst. as of now, i'm hard pressed to find a point to your question

OK I'll explain it to you. Automation changes the labor landscape as it has done since the industrial revolution. This is nothing new.

Re: Driverless semis have started running regular longhaul routes

#250

Post by dylan604 » Sat, May 03, 2025, 2:51 AM UTC

throwaway48476 wrote: post #217

dylan604 wrote: post #211

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How is this different from regulations for airline pilots requiring minimum downtime between flights? Or any other industry that requires minimum turn times. I've worked for feature film shoots that had to alter shoot schedules because days went long and the minimum required turn time forced the next day's call time to be pushed. It's always fun switching from a day to night schedule, and these minimum turn times are…

Film industry is likely a union rule not a federal one. Aviation the limits are much stricter than trucking.

film industry is most definitely a union rule, but that's not the point. that's my personal experience with a minimum turnaround, and it is something that makes a huge difference. applying that to what pilots/truckers experience was my way of being empathetic rather than just sympathetic. i've personally been there, done that. i've also been on those stupid jobs where you work late into the night, yet the pointy haired bosses still expect you to be at your desk at the regular time. that absolutely sucks, and will not allow that nonsense to happen to me again.