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The Uselessness of Phenylephrine (2022)

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Re: The Uselessness of Phenylephrine (2022)

#241

Post by AlbertCory »

jrgoff wrote: post #236
AlbertCory wrote: post #92

Public service announcement: sinus rinse (e.g. NeilMed) works. Available in every drug store with no prescription or pharmacist involvement necessary. It's gross, though. Do it in private.

Since I have seen a number of recommendations for sinus rinse in this thread but haven't (yet) noticed this specifically mentioned: It is important to use sterile water if you are using water for the rinse. Water directly from the tap apparently may not be safe for that purpose (there was a case earlier this year where a person died from a brain eating bacteria - they were apparently infected from using unboiled tap…

it's been discussed before here.

Re: The Uselessness of Phenylephrine (2022)

#242

Post by scarface_74 »

tptacek wrote: post #62
buildsjets wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

At least if I followed that path, I would not be required to have my purchase recorded in an insecure government database.

Why are you worried about the government recording your usage of Sudafed? What is anybody going to do with that information? Serious question! I understand the principle involved; I just want to know if there's some practical concern.

https://www.zdnet.com/article/buy-too-much-sudafed-and-you-m...

But if cops will choke someone to death about selling a cigarette, do you really want them to know about you buying Sudafed?

It’s funny that there is no outrage about a national psuedophredrine database. But people go nuts about a national gun database

Re: The Uselessness of Phenylephrine (2022)

#243

Post by maxerickson »

JJMcJ wrote: post #136
buildsjets wrote: post #9

The fact that phenylepherine is ineffective is quite old and has been common knowledge for many years. What is news is that the FDA is finally acknowledging it. I've maintained my own reserve of pseudoephedrine for years. https://gizmodo.com/report-many-over-the-counter-decongestan... https://www.forbes.com/sites/daviddisalvo/2015/10/26/the-pop... https://www.newscientist.com/article/2089555-breaking-bad-sn...

You can still get pseudoephedrine, for example Claritin D, the D for decongestant. It's not by prescription but you have to sign for it at the pharmacy desk, present ID, and I believe it's reported to FDA/DEA and there are limits to how much you can buy per month.

There's probably straight pseudoephedrine available anywhere you can get something with it added.

Based on a few comments here, having it behind the counter is apparently pretty much just a waste of time, with meth production having moved to some other synthesis.

Re: The Uselessness of Phenylephrine (2022)

#244

Post by scarface_74 »

freedomben wrote: post #223
scarface_74 wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Of course you are going to get downvoted and you should. I know my blood pressure medicine works for instance because every time I talk to my doctor about reducing it or getting off it, I monitor my blood pressure and it spikes. I know psuedophredrine works. And your data is just that, “anecdotal”, it’s no better than the people doing “research” by watching YouTube on the toilet.

GP didn't say your blood pressure meds or pseudoephedrine don't work, they said "most drugs don't work." I would have preferred some specifics, but we didn't get them so you shouldn't argue as though they were given.

Do you think that 80% of prescribed drugs don’t work? Even 50%? I’m limiting it to prescribed drugs because those are the ones that a pharmacists would be most concerned about.

And a “pharmacist” isn’t exactly the best trained person when it comes to knowing how to do a drug research or to know its efficacy for patients compared to even a GP who is monitoring patients and keeping records of blood work and other stats

Re: The Uselessness of Phenylephrine (2022)

#245

Post by Tao3300 »

rscho wrote: post #116

Phenylephrine is ineffective when taken orally. It is super effective topically or iv. I can definitely tell, because it's the most commonly used vasopressor used under anaesthesia (iv). Also used topically to avoid nosebleeds during nasal intubation.

I was indeed surprised to see it go by in the mix during one of my wife's c-sections. I'd always thought it was a completely useless thing, but there it was keeping her blood pressure stable under the anesthetics.

Re: The Uselessness of Phenylephrine (2022)

#246

Post by schrodinger »

clipsy wrote: post #158
tptacek wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you walk up to the pharmacy counter at any Walgreens or CVS, literally the first thing you're going to see is a shelf of decongestants.

I can’t speak for your Walgreens or CVS, but at mine you’ll see a shelf full of phenylephrine-based decongestants only, because the pseudoephedrine-based ones are behind the counter and out of sight.

Not trying to be condescending, but are you sure you're referring to "behind the pharmacy counter (i.e. where the pharmacist stands)" rather than on the regular shelves? That's where it's prominent—although as someone else noted there are often "see the pharmacist for the real stuff" cards on regular shelves too.

Re: The Uselessness of Phenylephrine (2022)

#247

Post by tptacek »

AnthonyMouse wrote: post #232
tptacek wrote: post #200

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The only liberty being sacrificed here is showing an ID at a pharmacy counter to get Sudafed. I'll stipulate that's a liberty being sacrificed, but it isn't "many". This particular "logbook" has existed for almost 2 decades now, and its scope hasn't creeped from there, so your second argument is pretty easy to shoot down. I think the evidence pretty strongly suggests that this policy, which was put in place to create…

> The only liberty being sacrificed here is showing an ID at a pharmacy counter to get Sudafed. It would be interesting to know if the people concerned about the need to show an ID to vote share that concern about the need to show an ID for access to medicine. > This particular "logbook" has existed for almost 2 decades now, and its scope hasn't creeped from there, so your second argument is pretty easy to shoot down…

You already need to show ID for most medicine! This is such a weird discussion.

Re: The Uselessness of Phenylephrine (2022)

#249

Post by tptacek »

scarface_74 wrote: post #242
tptacek wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why are you worried about the government recording your usage of Sudafed? What is anybody going to do with that information? Serious question! I understand the principle involved; I just want to know if there's some practical concern.

https://www.zdnet.com/article/buy-too-much-sudafed-and-you-m... But if cops will choke someone to death about selling a cigarette, do you really want them to know about you buying Sudafed? It’s funny that there is no outrage about a national psuedophredrine database. But people go nuts about a national gun database

It's almost like people generally understand why pharmacies are regulated to rate limit the purchase of Sudafed, and that the political consensus generally isn't an ideological opposition to any kind of regulation, the way you mind find it on a message board.

Sudafed PE is a much more salient and annoying topic than the behind-the-counter real Sudafed. I think it really does piss people off to get tricked into buying fake decongestant. But that's a separable issue from having to ask (and to show ID) to buy the real stuff.

Re: The Uselessness of Phenylephrine (2022)

#250

Post by scarface_74 »

tptacek wrote: post #249
scarface_74 wrote: post #242

Earlier quoted context omitted.

https://www.zdnet.com/article/buy-too-much-sudafed-and-you-m... But if cops will choke someone to death about selling a cigarette, do you really want them to know about you buying Sudafed? It’s funny that there is no outrage about a national psuedophredrine database. But people go nuts about a national gun database

It's almost like people generally understand why pharmacies are regulated to rate limit the purchase of Sudafed, and that the political consensus generally isn't an ideological opposition to any kind of regulation, the way you mind find it on a message board. Sudafed PE is a much more salient and annoying topic than the behind-the-counter real Sudafed. I think it really does piss people off to get tricked into buying…

I know of families who struggle to keep enough psuedophredrine in the house when their minor kids get sick and they need some for themselves.
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