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Russia opens criminal investigation of Meta over death calls on Facebook

reuters.com

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Re: Russia opens criminal investigation of Meta over death calls on Facebook

#241

Post by lucianbr »

bhuber wrote: post #231
jotm wrote: post #204

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I mean, what is the country going to do? At best they can launch a cyber attack (or a lot of them). Any physical action would immediately involve the host country - bombing the Facebook HQ for example could be considered a terrorist act or even a war declaration.

People who get on Putin's bad side have a history of ending up with things like polonium and nerve agents inside their bodies, even when living in western countries. Bombing facebook would likely be further than even Russia is willing to go, but I wouldn't put it past them to poison their head of PR or something. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poisoning_of_Alexander_Litvine... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sergei_Skri…

I expect that if Russia poisoned Zuckerberg there would be a lot more backlash from the West than in the cases you linked. Maybe even outright war.

Otherwise, it would mean the entire world should permanently live in fear of Putin, and that sounds worse even than nuclear winter.

Re: Russia opens criminal investigation of Meta over death calls on Facebook

#242

Post by bananabiscuit »

ensan wrote: post #223
bananabiscuit wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’m honestly hyped for a new golden age of movies and games where Russians are the bad guys. I feel like Russian bad guys always had more character and really made you want to see the hero outmaneuver them. Arabs just didn’t do it for me the last two decades.

“The old-fashioned racism didn’t cut it for me anymore. Excited to be racist towards a new group of people”

Just pointing out the world we live in.

Re: Russia opens criminal investigation of Meta over death calls on Facebook

#243

Post by bckr »

trhway wrote: post #179
Mountain_Skies wrote: post #172

Tech companies are making themselves active participants in conflicts involving powerful countries. Sooner or later, one of those countries is going to reach out and strike back in the physical world. It's just a matter of time. When it was little nudges in color revolutions in relatively weak countries, there was not much to worry about. Now? They're playing with fire and the tech folks doesn't seem they have a clue…

>Tech companies are making themselves active participants in conflicts involving powerful countries. sometimes there are situations when one can't be neutral. A genocidal war like the one Russia is waging in Ukraine is such a situation. >Sooner or later, one of those countries is going to reach out and strike back in the physical world. Like Saudis did. So, it is a personal choice of everybody - whether to live by Ru…

The UN definition of genocide requires acts of violence with the "intent to destroy, in whole or in part, a national, ethnical, racial or religious group, as such" (emphasis mine).[1]

Putin and Russian have made it clear that they intend to destroy the very idea of Ukraine.

For evidence of this, see[2], a book which has been used for the last 3 decades to indoctrinate individuals in the Russian government.

The existence of this book, and the fact that its author, Aleksander Dugin, has Putin's ear (and has even been called "Putin's Brain"), is evidence of the intent behind the invasion of Ukraine. In the eyes of Russian leadership, Ukraine does not exist.

To realize their goals, Russia does not need to kill all of the people of "the Ukraine" as they call it. Instead they must accomplish the erasure of the concept of Ukraine as a separate nation, people, and culture.

In other words, they must "destroy... a national... group, as such".

Therefore, according to the definition given by the UN of the term "genocide", the Russian war in Ukraine is genocidal.

All arguments that I have seen to the contrary point to the lack of intention to kill every Ukrainian. As shown above, killing everyone in a group is not required to constitute genocide.

I'll go one further. Here's the definition of "genocide" from Oxford:

"The deliberate killing of a large number of people from a particular nation or ethnic group with the aim of destroying that nation or group."

I don't think this could be simpler.

The Russian war in Ukraine is genocidal.

[1] https://www.un.org/en/genocideprevention/genocide.shtml

[2] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Foundations_of_Geopolitics

Re: Russia opens criminal investigation of Meta over death calls on Facebook

#245

Post by aasasd »

daenz wrote: post #21

The next Modern Warfare game is going to be very different than it's FPS predecessors.

Will it be an economic strategy where the player gets to decide to stop buying Russian gas by 2030? You know, do the one thing that Pu and buddies actually care about.

Re: Russia opens criminal investigation of Meta over death calls on Facebook

#246

Post by aasasd »

djohnston wrote: post #155

Russia also legalized piracy against unfriendly countries, surely this investigation will lead to substantive outcomes!

You might want to try finding sources for that. Other than neighbor HN comments. And differing from ‘a Duma member proposed that’.

Re: Russia opens criminal investigation of Meta over death calls on Facebook

#247

Post by monklu »

zozbot234 wrote: post #161
monklu wrote: post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Pardon me, but isn't that exactly what they're doing? > "As a result of the Russian invasion of Ukraine we have temporarily made allowances for forms of political expression that would normally violate our rules like violent speech such as 'death to the Russian invaders.' We still won't allow credible calls for violence against Russian civilians," a Meta spokesperson said in a statement.

"Death to the Russian invaders" is nationalistic propaganda of the sort that Putin likes to point to when he calls Ukrainians "nazis". It's not a sensible call to engage in self-defense. For one thing, it does not properly distinguish between ordinary Russians, of whom there are plenty in Ukraine (Russian even used to be an official language before the Ukraine government removed it as retaliation against the Crimea r…

You're desperately looking for a ground to stand on that simply do not exist -- please explain how Ukraine can "self-defend" and "stand their ground" without "death to the Russian invaders"?

Re: Russia opens criminal investigation of Meta over death calls on Facebook

#248

Post by boringg »

trhway wrote: post #237
boringg wrote: post #229

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nazism: Nazism is a form of fascism, with disdain for liberal democracy and the parliamentary system. It incorporates fervent antisemitism, anti-communism, scientific racism, and the use of eugenics into its creed. —- Where is the antisemitism, anti-communism, or eugenics - i don't see any of that which are CORE to nazism? Im sorry this situation is terrible in Ukraine but it is not genocide or nazism.

Only open antisemitism seems to be missing currently (though i'm not a Jew and can't really comment how being a Jew may feel these days in Russia) even though "global Zionism" as an enemy is present as undercurrent in the Great Russia myth, the anti-communism is definitely there, and racism and eugenics is a bit in the background and not declared clearly under those names (as the names carry baggage). Those specifics…

This sucks that we are debating how shirty the situation is in ukraine. It is terrible, non starter.

Unless I'm very misinformed I dont see any eugenics or antisemtism which are core to nazism. The words being used to describe this (genocide and nazisim) devalue the historic weight of those powerful words.

Re: Russia opens criminal investigation of Meta over death calls on Facebook

#249

Post by Etherlord87 »

tomjen3 wrote: post #225
jotm wrote: post #204

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I mean, what is the country going to do? At best they can launch a cyber attack (or a lot of them). Any physical action would immediately involve the host country - bombing the Facebook HQ for example could be considered a terrorist act or even a war declaration.

Russia lunched an attack with chemical weapons on U.K. soil and nothing happened.

I think what happens now can be partially explained as a consequence of bad deeds attributed to Russia in the past.

Re: Russia opens criminal investigation of Meta over death calls on Facebook

#250

Post by runarberg »

lazide wrote: post #167
runarberg wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Individual journalists indeed tried (and still do), however editors and upper management have always tried to steer their staff in the direction which mostly benefits their shareholders or their biggest advertisers. If journalists still persist and write stories exposing the wrong people, those journalists do loose their jobs and their stories do get canned or watered down (e.g. with equal presentation of “the other…

Eh, journalists are human and many have very strong political and ideological views that are quite apparent in their writing. Editors try to tie together the paper into a coherent voice and brand, which also needs to be able to ‘feed itself’ somehow. I wouldn’t put anyone on a high horse here.

Journalism is a craft which takes a level of expertise to master. Many journalists have spent decades mastering this craft which sometimes includes a degree in higher education. Knowing and adjusting for your biases is very much a part of this craft and good journalists do get really good at that skill. In fact knowing and adjusting for your biases is such a big part of journalism that you can assume that a journalist that doesn’t possess this skill is gonna be pretty poor at their job.

Now this is not to say that good journalists employ this skill effortlessly and infallibly. No of course not, however a good journalist will do this better then a person who is not skilled in the craft of journalism. You might claim that I’m putting journalists on a high horse here, however I’m only doing so by recognizing that they practice a craft with increasing skill levels. If this puts journalists on a high horse, then same can be said about physicists or doctors, in that they get better at their craft with practice.

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