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Italia Startup Visa

italiastartupvisa.mise.gov.it

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Re: Italia Startup Visa

#181

Post by happyscrappy »

nicolettad wrote: post #173
camillomiller wrote: post #163

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I finally moved to Germany. I tried, but could not bear it anymore. I miss my family and friends oh so badly, but staying? It would have been even worse. Those who stay are the ones with the real courage, people say. No, I'm really sorry, but those who stay are those who have their shoulders covered (by family, maybe) and may have some long-standing interests that give them enough stability to try what they want. But…

Thank you for your comment, you really express my thoughts. I'm sicking of hearing people say that, just because they're not willing to expat or because they have their shoulder covered. I wanted to live with my boyfriend, have my own house, buy me a new computer, etc... I couldn't do it in Italy. I could just work and live at home with my parents so I didn't had to pay rent and expenses. A lot of my friends does tha…

What does "shoulder covered" mean?

Re: Italia Startup Visa

#182

Post by jdimov »

Forget the corruption, crazy laws, favouritism and racketeering. The biggest problem you'll face doing business in Italy is the wide-spread, deep-rooted "it can wait" mentality that is really prevalent. No one can be bothered with anything. Be prepared to wait for months and months for trivial tasks that can be completed in 30 minutes. Be prepared for people to cancel meetings at the last minute, then set a new date and time just to miss that one too - repeat ad nauseam. Don't even try to explain the concept of a "deadline" to an Italian.

The worst part is you can't even hate them for this, because they're so friendly and likeable!

Other than that, it's a lovely country. Make your wealth elsewhere and go enjoy what Italy has to offer.

Re: Italia Startup Visa

#183

Post by SeanLuke »

I have friends who did a startup in Rome which went after government grants and contracts for software. I got to watch as they battled nepotism, insularity, incompetence, and extraordinarily sclerotic, glacial movement on part of the government and its affiliates and contractors, both as customers and as providers of standard societal services. Taxation is unbelievably high and bureaucratic for those (like my friends) who were straight shooters and wanted to pay taxes, unlike nearly all their competition, who dodged them.

My favorite story was when they were trying to get internet service in Trastevere. They were required to start paying the phone company (TI) as if they had internet service, and then wait. For three months. Then after they called TI wondering where the service was, they were told TI had sent someone out to install the service but he couldn't find their office. TI didn't bother to call them. So they were then required to go to the back of the queue and wait for another three months, all the while paying, followed by another excuse. This went on for the better part of a year. Meanwhile they ran the whole company off of cellular data plans.

And they're still there, and why? Because Trastevere is one of the most wonderful places in the world. It's worth it to them. But it's not surprising they're in the minority: Italy has a very, very serious brain drain problem.

Re: Italia Startup Visa

#184

Post by iolothebard »

lucaronin wrote: post #117

Oh come on. Some comments from “italians” here are really disgusting. I’m Italian, live in Italy and run a startup here. I know A LOT of guys who run successful businesses here (not me, yet!), who don’t have to deal with mafia, corruption and mandolinos. Is it harder here than in some other countries? For sure. Are there issues with taxes, regulations, etc? Hell yes. BUT. It’s not impossible to build great companies…

You're an Italian, this is for people outside of Italy.

Culture makes a big difference. Starting a company in other places is easier, this is likely why Italy is resorting to something like this to try to bring in more startups.

Just because someone says the truths about the issues with Italian society, doesn't make them "disgusting". Reality can be harsh.

Re: Italia Startup Visa

#185

Post by signal11 »

DeusExMachina wrote: post #78
edelweiss22 wrote: post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Which changes?

For example, in recent years a stupid regulation called "sector studies" have been introduced. Basically, they look at the average you should be earning in a specific field. If you report less than that amount in a tax declaration, you are assumed to be evading taxes. Practically you are assumed guilty until proven innocent, which is not as easy to do as you think. This is without adding other systemic diseases. Havi…

From what I have heard from my Indian friends, this is pretty much how tax inspections in India go too. Crazy.

Re: Italia Startup Visa

#186

Post by SeanLuke »

IndianAstronaut wrote: post #56
danmaz74 wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I was lucky not have the pleasure of such acquaintances but don't worry, if you become large enough or successful enough, they will come to you. I'm Italian too, live in Italy, and I'm really sick of this ill-informed self-disparaging attitude from so many Italians. There are millions of Italians who will say "I haven't personally never been touched by this, I don't even know anybody who was personally touched by i…

Italy is ranked as more corrupt than Brazil, South Africa and Bulgaria. It has very serious problems with crime and corruption. http://www.transparency.org/cpi2014/results#myAnchor1

Yeah, that's perception, not actuality.

Italy's got a lot of problems. But it's not Brazil, not by a long shot.

Italy's problem is bureaucracy and outright laziness far more than corruption or crime. And the fact that you can't fire anyone.

Re: Italia Startup Visa

#187

Post by aruggirello »

happyscrappy wrote: post #181
nicolettad wrote: post #173

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thank you for your comment, you really express my thoughts. I'm sicking of hearing people say that, just because they're not willing to expat or because they have their shoulder covered. I wanted to live with my boyfriend, have my own house, buy me a new computer, etc... I couldn't do it in Italy. I could just work and live at home with my parents so I didn't had to pay rent and expenses. A lot of my friends does tha…

What does "shoulder covered" mean?

It's an Italian way of saying that means you have someone (usually parents or relatives) who can help you get out of trouble. Literally sort of, "coat for the winter".

Re: Italia Startup Visa

#189

Post by svzdvd »

EvaK_de wrote: post #111
svzdvd wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's simple: because if you live here, you have to pay taxes here. A lot of taxes. And the Italian equivalent of IRS can just come to you and say that you don't pay enough, you're presumed guilty and you'll have to accept to pay a fine or try to prove you're innocent in court (which could take years).

Is this an older regulation or is it the result of Italy being more and more pressured by the EU to fix their household in recent years?

No, this isn't a result of the last crisis. The government is trying to reduce the amount of black economy but it's doing it in the wrong way. There are statistics that the government uses to calculate what you should earn every year, if you declare less than that amount, you're presumed guilty and you'll have to justify that...

Re: Italia Startup Visa

#190

Post by camillomiller »

happyscrappy wrote: post #181
nicolettad wrote: post #173

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thank you for your comment, you really express my thoughts. I'm sicking of hearing people say that, just because they're not willing to expat or because they have their shoulder covered. I wanted to live with my boyfriend, have my own house, buy me a new computer, etc... I couldn't do it in Italy. I could just work and live at home with my parents so I didn't had to pay rent and expenses. A lot of my friends does tha…

What does "shoulder covered" mean?

Yeah sorry, that's some Italian crawling through my English. It means "having a parachute" or maybe even "having your back covered". In other words, moving from a safe economical ground where you can easily return just in case anything goes wrong. Practically it means having rich parents or a stable financial situation because of your family's wealth.
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