We Wasted $50K on Google Ads So You Don't Have To (2019) • Hacker News Board

Re: We Wasted $50K on Google Ads So You Don't Have To (2019)

#181

Post by StavrosK » Sat, Jan 25, 2020, 11:48 AM UTC

shripadk wrote: post #155

StavrosK wrote: post #144

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You have inspired me to add a simpler landing page to one of my services: https://imgz.org/?v=s Also, should landing pages differentiate based on the query string ("?v=s" here), or be hosted on a new path?

Perfect. Clear, concise and to the point. Landing pages should preferably be hosted on its own path. Search engines index paths not the query string. Also, think this way: if you have multiple features, you can have a landing page per feature explaining that one feature in depth. Then you can have your Ads target that one feature page that everyone wants. This helps when you introduce new features tomorrow. Instead o…

That makes sense, thank you. I'm also guessing they need to go into the sitemap so search engines discover them, right?

I'm not sure I've ever searched for something and got a different landing page as a result (though maybe I just didn't notice), so I didn't realize this was something people do.

Re: We Wasted $50K on Google Ads So You Don't Have To (2019)

#182

Post by StavrosK » Sat, Jan 25, 2020, 11:49 AM UTC

RHSeeger wrote: post #170

StavrosK wrote: post #148

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thank you! In the interest of fairness, I have added a complicated landing page as well: https://imgz.org/?v=c I will break them out into new paths, thanks.

Those two pages are a brilliant summary of this entire thread. Well done.

Thanks!

Re: We Wasted $50K on Google Ads So You Don't Have To (2019)

#183

Post by going_to_800 » Sat, Jan 25, 2020, 1:07 PM UTC

shripadk wrote: post #43

Left a comment on the IndieHackers page. Keeping a copy here for those who aren't reading the comments section. I have noticed this a lot in various websites I have helped in ad campaigns. Their biggest problem is their landing page. Just like this article uses lots of jargons to explain simple concepts, their landing page reflects the same. For those of you wanting to know more about landing page optimization just w…

I'm really sick of all that "your keywords are too complex" or "people don't understand what you're saying", most of the times coming from people that know nothing about that niche or industry.

If those people are not your target market, don't give a shit about what they say related to the landing page content. You're not selling to them. If they don't understand the terminology used and they are not potential clients, you don't have to make a "less complex" landing page or change the wording just to make them happy.

Re: We Wasted $50K on Google Ads So You Don't Have To (2019)

#184

Post by dakna » Sat, Jan 25, 2020, 1:36 PM UTC

ChrisInEdmonton wrote: post #180

baddox wrote: post #147

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For many companies, the home page is probably simply not used for selling their product or informing new people about the company, and instead serves more as a symbol of the company's aesthetic and a way to welcome and comfort visitors. Think of it more like the well-appointed lobby of an office headquarters. I don't think anyone would expect the lobby of an office building to explain what the company does. It's just…

I disagree on Airtable. Their homepage currently says "Part spreadsheet, part database, and entirely flexible, teams use Airtable to organize their work, their way." I'm a software developer. I have no idea what they are selling, based on that. Is this some sort of souped up Google Sheets competitor? If so, what does it do better? Is this a team workflow management tool? If so, why bring up spreadsheets and databases…

> I'm a software developer.

I think that is why it is too generic for you. You already understand the underlying concepts of a spreadsheet, a database etc. Their target audience doesn't, but they know they need something _like_ that.

I think Airtable is in the no-code/low-code camp. Business people that have some technical ability and used to write Excel macros, can build a tool for their custom business process. Just like they did with MS Excel (or even MS Access) before.

And those people react to the buzzwords. "Oh, it can do a little bit of everything in one tool? And I can get it done without talking to the IT department? Book it."

I think you are too far ahead in your abilities to see the value it provides for people that rely on developer time to get anything technical done.

Re: We Wasted $50K on Google Ads So You Don't Have To (2019)

#185

Post by bob33212 » Sat, Jan 25, 2020, 2:12 PM UTC

TeMPOraL wrote: post #87

ryguytilidie wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I do recruiting consulting and it blows my mind how every time I ask a startup how they differentiate from other startups and what specific advantages they want me to discuss, they give me a bunch of meaningless phrases. Its like founders are being taught a different language that they think provides value but makes no fucking sense.

I'd love to know where they learn that. In my university years, I used to invent such ridiculously overblown phrases for simple things I did, as a form of mockery of corporate culture and my general pastime. But at some point I did realize that these phrases are hashing functions - like the ones you use in a hash table to put objects into buckets. So for a particular thing I do, say "adding colors to terminal applica…

"We find null and empty values in your tables and Excel files and prompt your users to fix them" sounds like a 10 dollar idea. How are you going to get employees and investors to really jump on board with that.

"We revolutionize Enterprise Data Quality with next generation AI in the cloud" sounds better to employees, investors, and in some cases buyers

Re: We Wasted $50K on Google Ads So You Don't Have To (2019)

#186

Post by bob33212 » Sat, Jan 25, 2020, 2:31 PM UTC

cosmodisk wrote: post #138

colechristensen wrote: post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The emperor has no clothes... there is a skill in speaking in an optimistic way using a series of intentionally vague words which smart people feel bad about not understanding so they just pretend they do and think positively about a product because for the life of them they could not articulate why the pitch/business/product didn't have any value. There's nothing to argue against because "I don't know what you're ta…

A few weeks ago had a call from a saleswoman,after multiple failed attempts ( she called a few people in the company until finally someone transferred across) she managed to talk to me. I get a fair share of emails,calls and LinkedIn messages because of my title- everybody is trying to sell. So I thought 'screw this, let's see what she's got to say'. After her intro, and me asking a number of questions,I was still no…

All they care about is getting you in a demo or free trial.

After that all they care about is getting you to agree that the demo looks good.

After that all they care about is getting you to agree that this product could be somehow useful in your company

Then they pounce. They ask when you are going to sign the contract because if you don't do it ASAP you will lose the discount. If you try to say that you don't want it, they start with the guilt trip. "I thought we had a deal. I have already booked my trip to come see you next week."

Re: We Wasted $50K on Google Ads So You Don't Have To (2019)

#187

Post by sweeneyrod » Sat, Jan 25, 2020, 3:45 PM UTC

trimboffle wrote: post #14

trimboffle wrote: post #9

This is such impressive blather that I’m now convinced I know nothing at all about modern sales and marketing. It may as well have been written by an ancient alien civilization for all I understood. Probably we’ll hear something very like this when SETI receives a signal from another star system.

>>> Thanks to developers’ trust in our core infrastructure and their recommendations, we’re fortunate to have a constant and growing inbound flow of leads and net negative churn, meaning the value of usage-driven upgrades outweighs the loss in revenue from subscription cancellations. I’m glad they clarified what “net negative churn” means, that really cleared things up.

I don't think this is that jargony. Anyone in the target audience for the article should know what "churn" means, and given that knowledge should be able to work out what "net negative churn" means. Probably the clarification would've been better if it had started "meaning the revenue from usage-driven upgrades" (and likewise "usage-driven" and "net" in "net negative" don't add anything) but overall it should still be comprehensible.

Re: We Wasted $50K on Google Ads So You Don't Have To (2019)

#188

Post by jccooper » Sat, Jan 25, 2020, 3:46 PM UTC

ryguytilidie wrote: post #83

TeMPOraL wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Don't get too fancy with your taglines. People don't have time to understand what you are saying. People don't like fancy terminologies except for what is popular. It's worse than that. And it's my pet peeve about many startup landing pages these days. It's not like people don't have time to understand - there's nothing there to understand ! "Full stack adaptive delivery" is a near-meaningless phrase. It can be con…

I do recruiting consulting and it blows my mind how every time I ask a startup how they differentiate from other startups and what specific advantages they want me to discuss, they give me a bunch of meaningless phrases. Its like founders are being taught a different language that they think provides value but makes no fucking sense.

It may work in in impressing people while speaking, where you have more attention and can elaborate on what you actually do later, and maybe people get trained to do this during the fundraising process, but in the online sales cycle... "That's nice. Ctrl-W."

Re: We Wasted $50K on Google Ads So You Don't Have To (2019)

#189

Post by WizardofLeads » Sat, Jan 25, 2020, 4:08 PM UTC

As a former Google Ads freelancer I very much enjoyed reading this.

You seem to have learned your lessons like you said and I actually picked up some interesting things from here. I'll be saving those Google docs!

I think the biggest lesson by far to be learned from this is that working with SEM agencies can be a complete clusterf*ck. Most of the time I'd recommend working with a freelancer who has a strong and verifiable background (most can be found in online communities).

Like you said the strategy these guys usually use is to throw stuff at the wall and see what sticks. In some, if not most cases they'll have scripts or software running to automate their campaigns without a human going into the account very frequently to weed out bad search terms.

While I 100% agree with most of your conclusions and the conclusions of the people on here commenting on your landing page wording, I do have one question: did you have a good, hard look at the search terms before deciding a keyword had to be removed?

O and yes, quality score is important. However I've seen and ran campaigns with a <5/10 quality score but with incredible CPC's. Don't get too hung up on QS - if it works it works, don't question it.

Re: We Wasted $50K on Google Ads So You Don't Have To (2019)

#190

Post by mraudiobook_com » Sat, Jan 25, 2020, 4:34 PM UTC

ryguytilidie wrote: post #83

TeMPOraL wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Don't get too fancy with your taglines. People don't have time to understand what you are saying. People don't like fancy terminologies except for what is popular. It's worse than that. And it's my pet peeve about many startup landing pages these days. It's not like people don't have time to understand - there's nothing there to understand ! "Full stack adaptive delivery" is a near-meaningless phrase. It can be con…

I do recruiting consulting and it blows my mind how every time I ask a startup how they differentiate from other startups and what specific advantages they want me to discuss, they give me a bunch of meaningless phrases. Its like founders are being taught a different language that they think provides value but makes no fucking sense.

I am building an illegal audiobook sharing site. Can you recruit me?